For you Maratac aficionados...

[NutSAK]

I have a SS LD01 and to me the are both in the same range quality wise... I do prefer the Maratac for the size and knurling.

I have both also and echo your thoughts.  I do find the slower PWM much more disturbing than the PWM on the LD01 SS, however.

[space cowboy]

Slower pwm on the Maratac? Could you please inform us what this means NutSak? Never heard this term before! Thanks.

[NutSAK]

Slower pwm on the Maratac? Could you please inform us what this means NutSak? Never heard this term before! Thanks.

PWM=Pulse Width Modulation.  This is the form of power regulation used in some multi-level torches.  Rather than reducing the current to the led for the lower modes, the circuit "strobes" the led to lower the overall output.  The faster the LED is strobed (higher frequency), the less likely it is you will notice this strobing effect.  Some folks are more susceptible to the PWM (such as myself) and it can be annoying at times, especially when moving or viewing moving objects.

There are a few ways to see this effect.  The easiest is to hold the flashlight in front of you, turned on, pointed at the ceiling at about waist level.  Then, shake the light back and forth rapidly while you're looking at the light emitting from the reflector.  You will see that a light operating with PWM doesn't leave an even "streak" of light before you, but rather a line of white dots.  PWM can also be seen if you shine a PWM light at the ceiling fan that is moving.  You will see an effect similar to a wagon wheel in a movie film, where the frequency of the light and the speed of rotation of the fan are interfering. 

This is very easy to see on a Maratac AAA, as the PWM frequency is low, vs. the higher frequency of the LD01 or Maractac AA.  You will only see this on the Med and Low levels, as the high level doesn't use PWM.  The high level will leave the "even streak" of light in the first experiment above.

It should be noted that PWM is a less efficient method of regulation than current regulation, and will result in shorter runtimes in comparison.  Higher-end, more efficient flashlights usually use current regulation, where less expensive flashlights often use PWM.

[space cowboy]

Got it...! Thanks NutSak!!

[Freudian Frog]

Thanks teach! I learned something new.

[space cowboy]

Yep... no Maratac for me! I was seriously looking at the Maratac though. I don't think I could take the strobe thing. Thank's to GG for the Arc! No problems & a great light! This Forum Rock's!!

[NutSAK]

Yep... no Maratac for me! I was seriously looking at the Maratac though. I don't think I could take the strobe thing. Thank's to GG for the Arc! No problems & a great light! This Forum Rock's!!

The Maratac might be worth a try for you.  It's a very nice light aside from the PWM, and many people don't even notice it.

[Sazabi]

Yep... no Maratac for me! I was seriously looking at the Maratac though. I don't think I could take the strobe thing. Thank's to GG for the Arc! No problems & a great light! This Forum Rock's!!

The Maratac might be worth a try for you.  It's a very nice light aside from the PWM, and many people don't even notice it.

While I don't have a AA to compare, I notice it on my AAA, but not on my Fenix E01 (as much); with that said, despite my less-than-perfect eyesight, I tend to be sensitive to certain things, and PWM is one of them.  Still, from what videos I've seen on their AA, I don't think I'd have any problems with it.   Besides, Space Cowboy, if you don't like it, drop me a PM. 

[NutSAK]

The E01 doesn't have PWM, it is current regulated.  The only Fenix models I'm aware that use PWM are the multi-level AAA lights such as the L0P-SE and the LD01.

There are some PWM regulated lights that have a high frequency that can't easily be detected in normal use:

NiteCore D10 (extremely high frequency--can't see it if you try)
4Sevens Q MiNi AA
4Sevens Q MiNi 123  (the MiNi's PWM frequency can be seen in the shake test, but I don't see it in use)

I agree that the Maratac AA is probably a high enough frequency, similar to the Fenix LD01, that you probably won't notice it unless you're really looking for it.

[Sazabi]

The E01 doesn't have PWM, it is current regulated.  The only Fenix models I'm aware that use PWM are the multi-level AAA lights such as the L0P-SE and the LD01.

There are some PWM regulated lights that have a high frequency that can't easily be detected in normal use:

NiteCore D10 (extremely high frequency--can't see it if you try)
4Sevens Q MiNi AA
4Sevens Q MiNi 123  (the MiNi's PWM frequency can be seen in the shake test, but I don't see it in use)

I agree that the Maratac AA is probably a high enough frequency, similar to the Fenix LD01, that you probably won't notice it unless you're really looking for it.

Whoops, I did forget that tidbit about the E01.  Hmm, question, though:  if current regulated lights tend to cost more than those with PWM, how was Fenix able to use current regulation on such an inexpensive light?    Yeah, I'm a n00b with lights, too. ^^;

[NutSAK]

It's not always the case...  However, you will find that PWM is used on multi-level lights.  PWM is a way to offer lower output levels without having to reduce the current to the LED. 

With the E01's circuit, the current can just be set to the desired drive level.  With a Maratac or a Fenix LD01, the drive current is set for the max level, and PWM is employed for med and low levels to reduce the output.  Basically, the LED is driven at the same current for the med and low levels, but since the LED isn't powered 100% of the time, output is reduced and runtime is increased.

Other lights, such as the rest of the Fenix line, use a separate current driver circuit for each level offered.  This is a more expensive, yet more power efficient way of offering multiple levels in one light.  The price of the circuit is not the only consideration when the decision is made to include PWM or current regulation into the design of the light.  Other considerations are space constraints (size of the circuit board), and how many levels are going to be offered.  If many levels are offered, such as in the NiteCore D10, a PWM circuit will most likely be used.

[Sazabi]

Thank you for clearing that up, Nut.

[Anthony]

I own two AAA Maratac lights and I don't notice any pulsing with the lights.  Maybe some people can register it in their brains and some can't

I've got a black AA model coming to me Monday (along with about $90 worth of other Countycomm stuff...), I'll see if I can notice any pulsing with that.

One oddity I noticed between my silver AAA and the black AAA is that the silver one can go through the three levels as fast as you can twist the head on and off...whereas with the black version, you have to wait about a second once you twist the head off for it to go to the next level when you twist it back on.  It doesn't effect how I use the lights at all, but just thought I'd mention it and see if anyone else noticed that.

[NutSAK]

If you haven't noticed it with the AAA, you certainly won't notice it with the AA.  The AA uses a higher PWM frequency that would be harder to detect.  The AA frequency is probably high enough that it wouldn't bother me.

Consider yourself lucky...  I really like the stainless Maratac AAA, except for the PWM.  I will likely be selling mine soon because I just don't use it.

[DaveK]

Since you posted this I've been trying to see it Terry, but I can't detect anything. I'm probably just too old or something, you know like hearing high frequency sounds and stuff

[Gareth]

One easy way to see it is to set the light on low, point it at a wall and wave your fingers back and forward through the spot of light.  You should see the shadow as a series of still images rather than one smooth image.  If you're not sure of the effect, set it on high and do the same with your fingers, the difference should be pretty obvious.

[John]

Like Gareth says   

[DaveK]

Just tried it. Nope, it's the same as any other light I've got

[Cuso]

Just tried it. Nope, it's the same as any other light I've got

What you are looking for is the PMW "effect" . The "strobing" you won't notice on normal use , unless you are very sensitive. Turn the light on at low , point it at you face and wave it, you should see "dots". If you put it on high and do the same , you should see a clean "streak", no dots. On a current regulated light, you will see "streaks" on all levels and no strobing effect.

[DaveK]

Still can't see it

[John]

Still can't see it

Dave try it against moving water with and without the light BTW you're doing this with just the low and medium levels I take it?

[SlackOne]

Easiest way I've seen to spot PWM is to point a light at a desk fan running on low speed.  The blades will start to look "choppy" in low speed PWM lights, whereas it's more of a blur on non-PWM.

[DaveK]

I'm bored of trying now tbh!

At least we can safely conclude that it doesn't bother me