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Archery. 5776

Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,944 Armed with camera and not afraid to use it.
Archery.
« on: February 24, 2015, 04:39:22 PM »
Seeing that we have a nice firearms thread rolling along, why not make one on archery. I am sure quite a few members are into archery, as an interest in knives, multi-tools, and the like go hand in hand with this...along with things that go boom, or poof depending on your choice of projectile force methodology.

So to start this thread off, I will show my 2009 Hoyt Helix Olympic recurve to you folks. I shot a winter league once with it and beat out plenty of compound shooters. Yeah, they do not like that very much.  >:D

At the time, I wanted medium level limbs as I wasn't going to compete at the International level. Thus, I got myself a pair of beautiful Hoyt Carbon 300 limbs. These limbs are very forgiving, accurate, and consistent.

Here is my Hoyt Helix riser in fire red flame with upgraded wooden grip. Those Carbon 300 limbs look great as well.





The bow is a beauty, and very comfortable to shoot.



For a sight, I re-purposed an older Toxonic right hand sight that I used on one of my other compounds, and bought myself a very nice 2X target scope with a fiber optic center dot.



Yes, that is a right handed sight, but works perfectly well flipped around for us lefties.



At the time, i also bought a Donkers V stabilizer that works wonders in steadying the hand.



The longer the better it stabilizes...and one should try a bow with and without such a system. It truly makes a world of difference.



So that is a quick tour of my Olympic style recurve.  :salute:

Let us see how far we can take this topic. :D

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Zombie Apprentice Posts: 18,451 Oxygen and magnesium toghether?! OMg!
Re: Archery.
« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2015, 04:51:09 PM »
Nice bow. What are the limbs specs? 70'' 34/36lbs.? Maybe 68''? The arrows don't seem very long...
 :tu: :tu:

You can use a scope in a recurve in official competition?!

 ???
« Last Edit: February 24, 2015, 04:54:19 PM by pfrsantos »

________________________________
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Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,944 Armed with camera and not afraid to use it.
Re: Archery.
« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2015, 05:10:50 PM »
The arrows are 30" Radial X Weave STL Hunters 200s.

The scope is on because I was last competing in a club winter league. I have various other sight pins that do not have glass in them.

The limbs are 40 pounds, and are 70" long.  :salute:

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Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 6,685 Stranger in a Strange Land
Re: Archery.
« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2015, 05:14:30 PM »
 :drool:

You have a very nice Bow Chako . All nice and put away snug in a, awesome hard case  :drool:

sweet accessories too  :tu:



I'd get back into archery if it wasn't sooooooooo expensive.


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Zombie Apprentice Posts: 18,451 Oxygen and magnesium toghether?! OMg!
Re: Archery.
« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2015, 05:17:59 PM »
The arrows are 30" Radial X Weave STL Hunters 200s.

The scope is on because I was last competing in a club winter league. I have various other sight pins that do not have glass in them.

The limbs are 40 pounds, and are 70" long.  :salute:

They seem smaller. Your draw length is 30''? That makes your limbs +/- 44lbs. Not bad!

 :salute: :cheers:

________________________________
It is just a matter of time before they add the word “Syndrome” after my last name.

I don't have OCD, I have OCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ.

Eff the ineffable, scrut the inscrutable.

IYCRTYSWTMTFOT

Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,944 Armed with camera and not afraid to use it.
Re: Archery.
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2015, 05:21:23 PM »
That is a very good guess. My draw length is 29".  :salute:
« Last Edit: February 24, 2015, 05:23:00 PM by Chako »

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Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,944 Armed with camera and not afraid to use it.
Re: Archery.
« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2015, 06:32:20 PM »
Now for something completely different...

I came across this web site...

http://libertyarchery.com/

...and thought to myself that looked intriguing. I bet that would make the perfect outdoor 3D range bow.

I then found this video at the time.



I just knew I would get one. Mine is a 60 pound 28.82" draw Liberty One which I purchased in 2011. Each bow is specially made for each archer. These are more personalized than a regular bow..hence the weird draw length.

I also got the soft case for it at the time, and am happy I did. It doesn't fit the sight, but the zippered case does make for a nice tight fit, even if the sight sticks out somewhat. It has not been an issue in transporting it back and forth to the range.





So the first thing I did was to upgrade the plastic sight with a much better one. It also needed some serious stabilization to combat the recoil, as I found too much of it going into my wrists. I found and bought the strangest but most effective stabilizer for it. In fact, I joke about how butt ugly both the bow and the stabilizer are. It was almost as if they were made for each other.



The Liberty One is very unique. You hold this on an angle, as evinced by the angled grip. It takes some getting used to...but with some practice, it feels very natural. There is a bit of unlearning and learning if you switch between this and a regular compound often.



The Hostage arrow rest did come from the factory and is a much needed style for use with this bow...as the geometry at play here are extreme.



Here is a look from the front looking backwards towards that Hostage arrow rest. Note the ugly stabilizer in front.



The original factory installed sights did fit in the case, but I found them very cheap and plasticky. I upgrade them to a nice Bone Collectors Apex lighted hunting sights. Not only did they extend my sight plane for added accuracy, they light up in dark forested locations...basically where the 3D outdoor range is.





This bow is a little beast, with its overly large and fairly aggressive cams. The large cams are a necessity, as anything smaller would make the string pinch at the arrow knock unusable.



Here is a closer look at the almost non-existent riser, angled grip, arrow rest, and stabilizer.



The bow came with a full set of instructions, a rope device to allow you to install a new string in the field...seeing that this bow won't fit most bow presses anyhow, and I still have the cheap plastic factory sight.



Because of the string geometry, you have to use a mechanical device with the Liberty One. You also need to use a nock loop as using the mechanical release on the string would push your arrows off of the string. I found a full length arm guard to be very useful at times with this bow...as you will have the occasional arm slap if you fiddle with that weird angled grip. In case you were wondering, that orange thing is an arrow puller. I found that I needed one of these to remove my arrows from foam targets, as this little bow packs quite a wallop.



And one last parting shot of that ugly stabilizer. What makes this one so effective is the movable weight on the end. I have tried quite a few different types of bow stabilizers and found this one to work the best. Bonus in that it sort of fits the bow in the looks department as well.



Now with this one, I shoot 28 1/2" Carbon Revolution Ultra Lights with an ultra stiff spine. These arrows are 5.5 grains per inch. I also use 1 1/2" stiff vinyl vanes with no helix.

I have found this bow to be a dream in the bush. It is also a real conversation starter as most folks have never seen one before. With the above arrow configuration, I have found that I have a very flat trajectory out to around 40-45 yards. Past that distance, and the arrow dramatically takes a nose dive. This means I can make the odd range error and I normally won't get penalized for it. At longer ranges however, I do need to be more accurate as there is less leeway due to the trajectory characteristics of the bow and arrow combination I am using.

So if you are looking for a neat little bow to terrorize the local 3D range, and/or hunt small game in brush ect...you should give the Liberty One a look over.

The biggest downside of the Liberty One is that it is custom made for you, meaning if you plan on reselling it later, you will have to find someone with the same draw length ect as you have.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2015, 07:03:37 PM by Chako »

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Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 6,685 Stranger in a Strange Land
Re: Archery.
« Reply #7 on: February 24, 2015, 06:41:59 PM »
I've never seen a bow like that liberty.

Its Pretty awesome Chako  :tu:

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Marketing Maven Administrator No Life Club Posts: 1,157 Does your head look like a watermelon?
Re: Archery.
« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2015, 07:05:05 PM »
I thought someone posted some information about that Liberty bow in my welcome thread? Or something like that?

Any photos from your archery practice of the bow in use? From shoots?
Action photos are always great.

I am apparently going to learn how to make a recurve bow from scratch this year. So excited.

-Megan
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Zombie Apprentice Posts: 18,451 Oxygen and magnesium toghether?! OMg!
Re: Archery.
« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2015, 07:19:34 PM »
I thought someone posted some information about that Liberty bow in my welcome thread? Or something like that?

Any photos from your archery practice of the bow in use? From shoots?
Action photos are always great.

I am apparently going to learn how to make a recurve bow from scratch this year. So excited.

You should use yew, it's stronger...
 :whistle:

________________________________
It is just a matter of time before they add the word “Syndrome” after my last name.

I don't have OCD, I have OCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ.

Eff the ineffable, scrut the inscrutable.

IYCRTYSWTMTFOT

Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,944 Armed with camera and not afraid to use it.
Re: Archery.
« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2015, 07:36:23 PM »
Yes, that would have been me.

As for photos...surprisingly enough, I never mixed archery with photography...probably because I din't want to haul around a camera while shooting.

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Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,944 Armed with camera and not afraid to use it.
Re: Archery.
« Reply #11 on: February 24, 2015, 08:03:30 PM »
Here is a third bow...this one is an APA Black Mamba MX1 in target flame red. Can you tell I like the colour red.

This one is fairly decked out, and is a tack driver. When I had this one dialed in, I was in serious danger of Robin Hooding my arrows...which is never a pleasant thing to do in reality as it cost you a lot of money each and every time it happens. Reason why you move to 5 single spot targets as opposed to only one.

Yes, the last time I took this one out to the range was in 2013. I try to use one bow for a season if possible to remain consistent.



I went all out on the sight for this one...a lovely Sure Loc in matching red hardware.



APA is a Canadian bow manufacturer. They make some really interesting bows. For example, the riser itself contains a built in hand carrier, broadhead wrench, knock adjuster, blade sharpener, and a pair of fang like protrusions that allow you to hang your bow on a tree limb quite nicely.



Their limb graphics on their target bows are also nice.



The model number is engraved into the limb pockets. I took a look on their website and they no longer make this model.



I like to use a 4X Viper Archery scope on this bow.



Like my Hoyt recurve, I also went all out on a V stabilizer.





To round the red is everything set, a nice Scott target mechanical release.



For arrows, I use the same ones that I use for the recurve, except these feature vinyl fletching.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2015, 09:09:21 PM by Chako »

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Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,944 Armed with camera and not afraid to use it.
Re: Archery.
« Reply #12 on: February 24, 2015, 08:53:44 PM »
Now the next one I have is an oldie, but I have kept this due to sentimentality. This was my Dad's good target bow back when we started. In fact, this was his second bow, and I can recall the day he gave it to me because he could no longer pull it.

By today's standards it is a beast. The Martin Onza came out in the 80s and disappeared around the early 1990's. We started archery a few years later, so at the time, it was a not that old used bow that my Dad picked up because he loved Martin.

Now when I first started archery, folks did not have carbon arrows, so archers tried to eek out every ounce of poundage they could muster to get faster and flatter trajectories. This Onza is no different in that it came with a built in overdraw, meaning you could shoot lighter shorter arrows and still keep your spine stiffness where you needed it to be. Likewise, this is an 80 pound bow. Plenty of older bows used by 3D target shooters of the time had high poundage. These days, with modern construction and technology, nobody need to be shooting such high poundage. But back in those days, large overdraws and high poundage was the key to remaining competitive.

Anyways, I had forgotten that I was bored one day back in 94 and decided to paint the case. I am surprised it still looks so good.



Still got a complete set of vintage Easton Autumn Orange XX75 2113 aluminum arrows for it. They haven't made these in years.

 

A quick look online also shows they no longer make this bad boy sight. This is a double pin Toxonic target sight. This allows you rotate the sight 180 for straight pin or scope.





Here is the built in overdraw.



At the time, Martin had these beautiful laser engraved wooden decorations on their bows.



Beautiful wooden grip.



This is such a classy bow, right down to the limb graphics.



And here is the bow in its entirety.



So although I gave away most of my older gear, I am keeping this one.  :salute:


« Last Edit: February 24, 2015, 09:02:04 PM by Chako »

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Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,944 Armed with camera and not afraid to use it.
Re: Archery.
« Reply #13 on: February 24, 2015, 09:01:38 PM »
And to try and keep this away from a gear only topic...

http://www.archeryhistory.com/index.php

One of the best Archery history websites around.

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Head Turd Polisher Administrator Just Bananas Posts: 61,304 Optimum instrumentum est inter aures
Re: Archery.
« Reply #14 on: February 24, 2015, 09:27:09 PM »
Yes, that would have been me.

As for photos...surprisingly enough, I never mixed archery with photography...probably because I din't want to haul around a camera while shooting.

I see a hundred places on those bows that one could easily mount a GoPro!

Def

Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.
Marketing Maven Administrator No Life Club Posts: 1,157 Does your head look like a watermelon?
Re: Archery.
« Reply #15 on: February 24, 2015, 09:38:20 PM »
Yes, that would have been me.

As for photos...surprisingly enough, I never mixed archery with photography...probably because I din't want to haul around a camera while shooting.

I see a hundred places on those bows that one could easily mount a GoPro!

Def

Oh great. Is that what we're doing this weekend? It is too cold.

-Megan
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No Life Club Posts: 4,713 I'm an Adult?!?! When did that happen?
Re: Archery.
« Reply #16 on: February 25, 2015, 12:40:11 AM »
I've got a Martin Firecat and a set of XX75 1818 arrows kicking around somewhere.
Also a set of more appropriate carbon arrows for it.
Should dig them out for a laugh and some photos.

Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,944 Armed with camera and not afraid to use it.
Re: Archery.
« Reply #17 on: February 25, 2015, 03:10:05 AM »
 :worthless:

 :D

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Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,944 Armed with camera and not afraid to use it.
Re: Archery.
« Reply #18 on: February 25, 2015, 01:52:44 PM »
For the beginner...


Mistakes in archery and how to prevent them...


A slideshow that may require you to pause it..but not bad for historical content...

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Marketing Maven Administrator No Life Club Posts: 1,157 Does your head look like a watermelon?
Re: Archery.
« Reply #19 on: February 25, 2015, 02:37:41 PM »
I enjoy the 3D Shoots the most.
I currently shoot just a Matthews compound bow. Debating on whether I am going hunt or not this year.

I desperately need to pick up some more arrows.

-Megan
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Head Turd Polisher Administrator Just Bananas Posts: 61,304 Optimum instrumentum est inter aures
Re: Archery.
« Reply #20 on: February 25, 2015, 03:25:23 PM »
I have a super cheap fiberglass recurve with a 30 lb (or so) draw.  It's a toy, and I debated even posting it, but then I decided I really wanted to hang out with the cool kids.

I also need to get more arrows.  Unless you manage a really good shot the neighbors' kids always manage to run away.

Def

Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.
Marketing Maven Administrator No Life Club Posts: 1,157 Does your head look like a watermelon?
Re: Archery.
« Reply #21 on: February 25, 2015, 05:04:39 PM »
If you're a good boy I will let you use the recurve I'm going to craft.
 :P

-Megan
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Hero Member Posts: 978
Re: Archery.
« Reply #22 on: February 25, 2015, 05:08:08 PM »
I am sporting a 1998 Jennings Black Lightning with the large wheels 55#, Martin Jaguar take down 45#, PSE Heritage Razorback 35#, and my a 2008 Horton Explorer150 that has seen very little use due to most ranges not being crossbow friendly.
I was shooting that Jennings as my hunting bow in early 2k but gave it up after an unrelated injury made wrist compression painful. I didn't really get back to shooting archery for about 6 years due to other distractions.

Then My home state changed its hunting laws to allow  crossbows for all seasons except archery. :facepalm:

I picked up the Horton as a replacement For a PSE Copper Head that tore itself apart...who would put standard string cleats on a crossbow.  The potential for the string to roll on the flight groove and twist itself off the cable is quite disastrous. That's why I switched to a model that attached the string to the wheels directly.

The Jaguar and Razorback Are more recent.
I got back into archery after moving To a new state and closer to a big city and realizing the cost of shooting ranges tripled cutting my trigger time, but the archery ranges were both cheaper and more useful than they were living in the out sticks were you could shoot in your yard.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2015, 05:11:55 PM by Noa Isumi »

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Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 6,685 Stranger in a Strange Land
Re: Archery.
« Reply #23 on: February 25, 2015, 05:15:08 PM »
Ok now I'm jealous. 

I also have no idea what I want for a bow now.

I have been drooling over a Matthews solo cam but I'm totally unsure now after doing some thinking.
.


I don't hunt anymore .

I'm thinking a target bow may be a better fit for me.

« Last Edit: February 25, 2015, 05:16:59 PM by JAfromMn »

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Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,944 Armed with camera and not afraid to use it.
Re: Archery.
« Reply #24 on: February 25, 2015, 07:04:36 PM »
The first thing you need to know is what are you planning to use it for. You wouldn't go hunting with a target bow...simply because it would be all the wrong colour, and also because the poundage might not be enough to legally or consciously hunt in your area. Plenty of folks will use 35 to 45 pound bows for target practice. In my region, you shouldn't hunt with anything less than 60 pounds.

Second thing is to find a bow that fits you. More so than firearms, bows have to personally fit you for draw length, peep sight attachment, knock settings, shooting styles ect.

Which leads to the type of bow you are looking for. Bows that allow you to shoot shorter arrows, maybe by use of an overdraw, or a reflex riser design (bow goes towards archer) tend to be a little harder to shoot as any wrist movement will magnify itself at your arrow rest. On the up side, these type of bows tend to be faster overall. Deflex risers (the riser goes away from the archer) are great on target bows as they are the most forgiving, but at the cost of speed.

On top of that, you get different cams on compounds. Wheels are great for target shooters where smoothness of draw and little to no stacking is beneficial. On the other end of the spectrum, you have severe cams that stack plenty but also store more energy. They won't make your job of target bulls-eye shooting any easier, but that extra speed will help out on the 3D range. Mind you, not good trying to pull an extreme cam whilst cold up in a tree stand hunting. Like everything else, it can be done but will require more practice.

Which ultimately leads to the type of bow overall. So far, I am only talking about compounds. There are also recurves and long bows. Recurves are a nice compromise as the curved limbs give you that bit of stacking, but also that bit of zip off the arrow rest. They also tend to reduce hand shock unlike stick bows like long bows. It all depends on what you are looking for to do with it?

I know plenty of archers that have gotten tired of the technical compound and moved onto a much simpler Traditional style such as a recurve or longbow. Some will go all the way and not even use a sight...preferring to eschew all that can go wrong like broken cables, lost nuts and bolts, etc. I myself have a PSE Sequoia flatbow (type of longbow) and a Scythian horse bow for those times when I just want to have good fun shooting. With practice, you can get very very good with one of these...then you get the pleasure of showing off to those guys saddled with all that tech.  >:D

Bows are like everything else, you will find it hard to have just the one. Most will have a compound and some sort of simpler wood bow. Nothing wrong with that Matthews solo cam. At least the single cam will eliminate timing issues (When you need two cams to roll together to maximize potential energy into kinetic energy). The downside to a single cam...they tend to be a little slower than double cam bows on average.

If you want to get into archery for the fun of it, I would suggest you get a nice recurve or longbow, a dozen arrows, maybe an arrow rest or off the shelf, and some sort of shooting glove or tab. That would be the cheapest way to get into it. If you are looking for a hunting compound, that single cam would do the trick. For first time buyers, I suggest buying an already made beginner kit as that would be the cheapest. Mind you the best advice would be to visit a few local archery clubs, archery shops, etc and get plenty of info. Just remember that the shops and clubs may be somewhat biased.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2015, 07:54:02 PM by Chako »

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Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 6,685 Stranger in a Strange Land
Re: Archery.
« Reply #25 on: February 25, 2015, 07:32:50 PM »
I got alot of looking and learning to do before I get another bow.

I think the last bow I bought I got about 1993.

Thanks for all the info Chako

Defend the Hive!!!
Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 7,299
Re: Archery.
« Reply #26 on: February 25, 2015, 08:24:38 PM »
Wanted to get back into archery for years now, just like to shoot targets.

Would love to get a simple compound bow.

Last bow I owned was a Fred Bear Whitetail 2 back in the 80's. Wish I still had it.


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Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 6,628
Re: Archery.
« Reply #27 on: February 25, 2015, 10:31:47 PM »
I really want a recurve. A bit more old school than compound.

No Life Club Posts: 4,713 I'm an Adult?!?! When did that happen?
Re: Archery.
« Reply #28 on: February 26, 2015, 03:59:04 AM »
:worthless:

 :D

Okay, now you have to promise not to laugh. This was pretty good gear 20 years ago. Not top shelf by any means, but not complete rubbish either.

well, the sight was a bit crap, a Toxonics bar with an old Arten sight and a cheapie scope. Hey, it worked.













« Last Edit: February 26, 2015, 04:00:11 AM by PTRSAK »

Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 7,299
Re: Archery.
« Reply #29 on: February 26, 2015, 10:09:24 AM »
Anyone have any experience with the PSE Stinger X?

It is the bow I am thinking about getting soon.

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