Will Victorinox ever...

[george1]

I've always wondered if you can just put the scales from that model with the clip onto other 111 mm models?

Sadly you can't. The scales don't have the recess for the corkscrew/phillips driver.

Thanks. Its obvious now that l look at it.
I've been dreaming of a an OHO Outrider with a pocket clip for a while now.
I think l once saw that Wenger had a 130 mm Ranger with a pocket clip, but I've  never seen one for sale.

[pomsbz]

'Super steels' are really not all that hard to sharpen. S35VN or M390 will sharpen up pretty easily on my Spyderco Sharpmaker for example. 154cm will sharpen up even more easily. The fact that I can sharpen my SAK by stropping it up on my chinos doesn't make more modern steels hard or impossible to sharpen. A SAK is ridiculously easy to sharpen but you pay the price with a blade that needs it far more often. Actually it doesn't due to superb geometry which keeps cutting even when far from properly sharp but in theory. 

[Don Pablo]

'Super steels' are really not all that hard to sharpen. S35VN or M390 will sharpen up pretty easily on my Spyderco Sharpmaker for example. 154cm will sharpen up even more easily. The fact that I can sharpen my SAK by stropping it up on my chinos doesn't make more modern steels hard or impossible to sharpen. A SAK is ridiculously easy to sharpen but you pay the price with a blade that needs it far more often. Actually it doesn't due to superb geometry which keeps cutting even when far from properly sharp but in theory. 

Ah, thats the problem. I rarely use a blade, so I can't justify a Sharpmaker or similar. Hence, no super steels for me.

[pomsbz]

'Super steels' are really not all that hard to sharpen. S35VN or M390 will sharpen up pretty easily on my Spyderco Sharpmaker for example. 154cm will sharpen up even more easily. The fact that I can sharpen my SAK by stropping it up on my chinos doesn't make more modern steels hard or impossible to sharpen. A SAK is ridiculously easy to sharpen but you pay the price with a blade that needs it far more often. Actually it doesn't due to superb geometry which keeps cutting even when far from properly sharp but in theory. 

Ah, thats the problem. I rarely use a blade, so I can't justify a Sharpmaker or similar. Hence, no super steels for me.

I think that's the point though. Most SAK owners are probably like yourself. Hence super easy sharpening for the non blade enthusiast.

[cbl51]

I ove the steel that Vic uses and hope they never change. I love that I can use the bottom of a coffee mug, soup bowl, leather belt, top of a car window, to touch up the blade. Soooo easy to sharpen.

If Vic had to change anything, I wish they would ditch the d--med cellidor handle scales for some more modern plastic that will not crack up if dropped on a hard surface, or melt if comes in contact with bug repellent or gun solvents. Get rid of the cellidor and keep the steel!

[Syph007]

'Super steels' are really not all that hard to sharpen. S35VN or M390 will sharpen up pretty easily on my Spyderco Sharpmaker for example. 154cm will sharpen up even more easily. The fact that I can sharpen my SAK by stropping it up on my chinos doesn't make more modern steels hard or impossible to sharpen. A SAK is ridiculously easy to sharpen but you pay the price with a blade that needs it far more often. Actually it doesn't due to superb geometry which keeps cutting even when far from properly sharp but in theory. 

Ah, thats the problem. I rarely use a blade, so I can't justify a Sharpmaker or similar. Hence, no super steels for me.

I think that's the point though. Most SAK owners are probably like yourself. Hence super easy sharpening for the non blade enthusiast.

Joe average guy will also just buy a new SAK if his old one gets dull.  I swear I read a poll or survey somewhere that concluded as much.

[Don Pablo]

'Super steels' are really not all that hard to sharpen. S35VN or M390 will sharpen up pretty easily on my Spyderco Sharpmaker for example. 154cm will sharpen up even more easily. The fact that I can sharpen my SAK by stropping it up on my chinos doesn't make more modern steels hard or impossible to sharpen. A SAK is ridiculously easy to sharpen but you pay the price with a blade that needs it far more often. Actually it doesn't due to superb geometry which keeps cutting even when far from properly sharp but in theory. 

Ah, thats the problem. I rarely use a blade, so I can't justify a Sharpmaker or similar. Hence, no super steels for me.

I think that's the point though. Most SAK owners are probably like yourself. Hence super easy sharpening for the non blade enthusiast.

Joe average guy will also just buy a new SAK if his old one gets dull.  I swear I read a poll or survey somewhere that concluded as much.

Aw geez. Thats like throwing the car away when the tires wear out.

[Steinar]

I think that's the point though. Most SAK owners are probably like yourself. Hence super easy sharpening for the non blade enthusiast.

Joe average guy will also just buy a new SAK if his old one gets dull.  I swear I read a poll or survey somewhere that concluded as much.

I doubt he'd do so if the knife had the price which inevitably follows a steel which is more expensive to buy, and more expensive to machine, heat treat and grind. Then he'd simply use a blunt knife. It is utterly astonishing what people are willing to use. I am a lazy guy, so I wait too long sharpening a knife, but what Joe Average Guy does is simply scary.

[Don Pablo]

Or never changing the oil?
https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/51l80h/audi_tt_after_135000_kilometers_without_an_oil/
Sorry, I thought that the pic in link was crazy and wanted to show you all.

[Sparkey]

I think that's the point though. Most SAK owners are probably like yourself. Hence super easy sharpening for the non blade enthusiast.

Joe average guy will also just buy a new SAK if his old one gets dull.  I swear I read a poll or survey somewhere that concluded as much.

I doubt he'd do so if the knife had the price which inevitably follows a steel which is more expensive to buy, and more expensive to machine, heat treat and grind. Then he'd simply use a blunt knife. It is utterly astonishing what people are willing to use. I am a lazy guy, so I wait too long sharpening a knife, but what Joe Average Guy does is simply scary.

I used to work with a guy who kept his knife dull bc he was "afraid he would cut himself". I then proceeded to explain that more people are injured by dull knives than sharp ones.

"But I might cut myself" he replied.

I walked away and carried a few extra band-aids from there on out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Aloha]

Or never changing the oil?
https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/51l80h/audi_tt_after_135000_kilometers_without_an_oil/
Sorry, I thought that the pic in link was crazy and wanted to show you all.

 

[Frailer]

I think that's the point though. Most SAK owners are probably like yourself. Hence super easy sharpening for the non blade enthusiast.

I know you didn't mean to sound condescending when you said that, but I'd like to point out that not all blade enthusiasts are *steel* enthusiasts.

While working my way through college one of my jobs was as a meatcutter for a steak restaurant. While doing that job I gained a real appreciation for a blade that could be made very sharp with minimal effort and touched up quickly so I could get back to work.  The vast majority of people who actually make their living using knives (i.e. the *real* "serious knife users") feel the same way.

I do have a couple of fixed blade knives made of more exotic steels, but VG-10 is as high up the modern steel ladder I'll go for the folders I actually carry. It's a choice I made *consciously*, not out of ignorance.

Whenever I see someone "testing" their S110V knife on 500 linear feet of cardboard, I think to myself, "Dude, buy a box cutter."

I'm not saying those who would like a super steel on their SAK are wrong, but we all know it isn't going to happen in the Victorinox factory. Fortunately, there are some gifted guys out there (like Syph) who can make marvelous things happen.

Have any steel enthusiasts approached third-party makers about getting replacement blades made?

[Aloha]

'Super steels' are really not all that hard to sharpen. S35VN or M390 will sharpen up pretty easily on my Spyderco Sharpmaker for example. 154cm will sharpen up even more easily. The fact that I can sharpen my SAK by stropping it up on my chinos doesn't make more modern steels hard or impossible to sharpen. A SAK is ridiculously easy to sharpen but you pay the price with a blade that needs it far more often. Actually it doesn't due to superb geometry which keeps cutting even when far from properly sharp but in theory. 

 I have a few steels and my take is similar as ^^^.  Just for clarity, when my edge is no longer performing as I expect then what I do is strop.  If I've used the knife and rolling or micro edge issued have occurred then I will use a ceramic rod then strop.  I did have chips that needed more than what I have described. 

My point is, maintaining an edge of "super" or "higher" end steels would be <<similar>> to what most do on their SAKs IMO.  Strop, or ceramic rod. 

It might very well be my take on things.

Now re-profiling say S30V for the true novice with little to no gear is a whole other conversation.   

[Aloha]

I think that's the point though. Most SAK owners are probably like yourself. Hence super easy sharpening for the non blade enthusiast.

I know you didn't mean to sound condescending when you said that, but I'd like to point out that not all blade enthusiasts are *steel* enthusiasts.

While working my way through college one of my jobs was as a meatcutter for a steak restaurant. While doing that job I gained a real appreciation for a blade that could be made very sharp with minimal effort and touched up quickly so I could get back to work.  The vast majority of people who actually make their living using knives feel the same way.

I do have a couple of fixed blade knives made of more exotic steels, but VG-10 is as high up the modern steel ladder I'll go for the folders I actually carry. It's a choice I made *consciously*, not out of ignorance.

Whenever I see someone "testing" their S110V knife on 500 linear feet of cardboard, I think to myself, "Dude, buy a box cutter."

 

   

[AimlessWanderer]

I would say most knife owners don't sharpen their knives, and most of those who do, have no idea what the hell they are doing. A lot will use one of the pull through kitchen sharpeners.A friend's father sounded very proud when he said he keeps his knife (Climber) sharp on an oilstone. The edge was dull, chipped, and the included angle was almost certainly over 60 degrees.

I confiscated it for an hour or so, replaced the cracked scales with plus scales with all the accessories, and properly sharpened both blades. It took several passes through an edge sharp with the green belt to get anywhere close to the proper profile. I finished the edge with a diamond steel to put a bit of bite on it, and he said he didn't realise the knives could take such a good edge. 

The next time I saw him use it, he was slicing through electrical cable which was resting on a steel surface...

 

Sometimes it's just not worth the effort ...

[kaput]

Whats wrong with the Vic steel?
Cheap.
Edge retention: Very reasonable for the price.
And when it does go blunt... You can sharpen it Very easily.

Personally, if Vic used super steel, I would be lost. 
I have no clue how to sharpen that stuff. 
Hence, I would not use SAKs.   

Nobody said there was anything wrong with Vic's current steel. Just posed the question if they'd ever make a pocket knife with "better" steel.. 

[Mechanickal]

Whats wrong with the Vic steel?
Cheap.
Edge retention: Very reasonable for the price.
And when it does go blunt... You can sharpen it Very easily.

Personally, if Vic used super steel, I would be lost. 
I have no clue how to sharpen that stuff. 
Hence, I would not use SAKs.   

Nobody said there was anything wrong with Vic's current steel. Just posed the question if they'd ever make a pocket knife with "better" steel.. 

Why?
If there's nothing wrong with my car, I'm not replacing it with something "better"

In the end I'll get from point A to B just as easy, only more stylish and at a higher price

[Faddy Daddy]

I would say most knife owners don't sharpen their knives, and most of those who do, have no idea what the hell they are doing. A lot will use one of the pull through kitchen sharpeners.A friend's father sounded very proud when he said he keeps his knife (Climber) sharp on an oilstone. The edge was dull, chipped, and the included angle was almost certainly over 60 degrees.

I confiscated it for an hour or so, replaced the cracked scales with plus scales with all the accessories, and properly sharpened both blades. It took several passes through an edge sharp with the green belt to get anywhere close to the proper profile. I finished the edge with a diamond steel to put a bit of bite on it, and he said he didn't realise the knives could take such a good edge. 

The next time I saw him use it, he was slicing through electrical cable which was resting on a steel surface...

 

Sometimes it's just not worth the effort ...

Ha ha, a couple of posts in this thread are giving me a good laugh, the "Dude, get a box cutter" and this one from 50ft-trad about cutting cable on a steel surface, awesome!
Honestly, this is reason why the drag through sharpeners are worth it for some people. Heck, I'll confess to having an accu sharp out in the garage and I've used it before. (I now have some ceramic rods which seem to do a very nice job). But yes, if someone is abusing the blade to such a degree and just wants a quick edge to batter some more why not a drag through sharpener?
Anyhow, I know very little about differing types of steel but I will say Victorinox seems on the soft side to me. When I found or re purposed the old deluxe tinker from my grandpa I noticed the blade tip had a slight bend to it. I'm thinking this is better than being brittle and breaking and also, wow, it really does seem to sharpen quickly and well.

[kaput]

Whats wrong with the Vic steel?
Cheap.
Edge retention: Very reasonable for the price.
And when it does go blunt... You can sharpen it Very easily.

Personally, if Vic used super steel, I would be lost. 
I have no clue how to sharpen that stuff. 
Hence, I would not use SAKs.   

Nobody said there was anything wrong with Vic's current steel. Just posed the question if they'd ever make a pocket knife with "better" steel.. 

Why?
If there's nothing wrong with my car, I'm not replacing it with something "better"

In the end I'll get from point A to B just as easy, only more stylish and at a higher price

Simple answer. Options.

Obviously Victorinox likes offering options lol with their dozens and dozens of knife selections. 

[Ron Who]

High edge retention is but one of the desired properties in a knife steel. Victorinox uses a good steel with good properties for daily use.

[theonew]

For $5 you can get a Smith's Pocket Diamond Retractable Sharpener that will sharpen any of the super steels. I'd be fine with a harder Vic steel but only if it could be made and used without issues in the current blade profile of their pocket knives. If in that profile the blade was prone to rusting, cracking or chipping, no thanks. I'm quite happy with the steel they use now.

[Frailer]

Whats wrong with the Vic steel?
Cheap.
Edge retention: Very reasonable for the price.
And when it does go blunt... You can sharpen it Very easily.

Personally, if Vic used super steel, I would be lost. 
I have no clue how to sharpen that stuff. 
Hence, I would not use SAKs.   

Nobody said there was anything wrong with Vic's current steel. Just posed the question if they'd ever make a pocket knife with "better" steel.. 

Why?
If there's nothing wrong with my car, I'm not replacing it with something "better"

In the end I'll get from point A to B just as easy, only more stylish and at a higher price

Simple answer. Options.

Obviously Victorinox likes offering options lol with their dozens and dozens of knife selections. 

They do indeed make dozens of options available...as long as they fit within their current, highly refined manufacturing process. 

With that said, they are willing to modify these processes to produce their Damascus limited editions, so perhaps there is a teeny-tiny chance...

While I'm a non-steel-enthusiast knife enthusiast, I can respect those whose opinions differ from mine. I don't find a harder, tougher steel to be "better" for my purposes, but your mileage may vary.

I do, however, wonder if the SAK fans of the world are ready for a $400 Tinker in CPM S90V.

[EMZ]

From "Meet Sandvik 2/99":
"Cutting argument from Sandvik. Swiss company Victorinox, which produces the world-renowned Swiss Army Knife, is an important Sandvik Steel customer. Victorinox purchases specially developed cutlery steel with properties that match the company’s extremely high quality requirements in terms of the steel’s chemical composition, mechanical properties and thickness tolerances. It becomes rapidly evident that the only very best is good enough for this leading Swiss manufacturer when, for example, you study the most advanced
product in the Victorinox range, a pocket knife with 33 different functions and an optimal finish."

Vic makes lot of different types of knives. The cheapest way is to use a minimum of  steel types for a maximum of purposes. The iron files of the pocket knives have other specs than its cutting blades. Maybe other tools, for example the siccors, also have different specs.
Metallurgy is a real science (of which I have no knowledge).

[MacGyver]

Will Victorinox ever...put pocketclips on their medium to large size knives? 

Don't get me wrong, but i absolutely abominate pocket clips on pocket knives, especially on sak's  . Even less if anyone from Vic ever had that idea for my beloved 91mm/84mm. 
I think it absolutely ruins a Sak look and elegance, or any elegant pocket knife for that mater IMHO. It may be practical on multi's or tactical knives (not that i like the look either way), but if they put it in, i hope they'll only do it on 111mm up.

[an0nemus]

Will Victorinox ever...put pocketclips on their medium to large size knives? 

Don't get me wrong, but i absolutely abominate pocket clips on pocket knives, especially on sak's  . Even less if anyone from Vic ever had that idea for my beloved 91mm/84mm. 
I think it absolutely ruins a Sak look and elegance, or any elegant pocket knife for that mater IMHO. It may be practical on multi's or tactical knives (not that i like the look either way), but if they put it in, i hope they'll only do it on 111mm up.

Agree with you. Only on the bigger SAKs and only as detachable options, like with other multitools

[carboncopy101]

Hmm. Not really supersteel but id like the blade steel on a spyderco salt or something similar to be used with a sak. I'd like to bring my saks on the beach or on the boat pre-dive since its definitely handy. Granted i wont wet the sak in salt water but the rust from just the exposure is kinda bad and i dont typically wash saks since i cant open it up as i please. I guess having a maintenance free sak is a good step.

[Mechanickal]

Hmm. Not really supersteel but id like the blade steel on a spyderco salt or something similar to be used with a sak. I'd like to bring my saks on the beach or on the boat pre-dive since its definitely handy. Granted i wont wet the sak in salt water but the rust from just the exposure is kinda bad and i dont typically wash saks since i cant open it up as i please. I guess having a maintenance free sak is a good step.

Isn't it so that the steel itself is fairly unaffected by salt water, but the alox liners suffer?

[Don Pablo]

Hmm. Not really supersteel but id like the blade steel on a spyderco salt or something similar to be used with a sak. I'd like to bring my saks on the beach or on the boat pre-dive since its definitely handy. Granted i wont wet the sak in salt water but the rust from just the exposure is kinda bad and i dont typically wash saks since i cant open it up as i please. I guess having a maintenance free sak is a good step.

Isn't it so that the steel itself is fairly unaffected by salt water, but the alox liners suffer?

All the corroded SAKs I've seen, the liners were in bad shape, rivets too, but the tools pristine.
Better steel wouldn't help here.

[MacGyver]

I can't really understand what would different fancier steels would bring in added value and functionality to regular (pocket) SAK use....
At least to my view of what a sak is for, and how it's meant to be... 

[Mechanickal]

Hmm. Not really supersteel but id like the blade steel on a spyderco salt or something similar to be used with a sak. I'd like to bring my saks on the beach or on the boat pre-dive since its definitely handy. Granted i wont wet the sak in salt water but the rust from just the exposure is kinda bad and i dont typically wash saks since i cant open it up as i please. I guess having a maintenance free sak is a good step.

Isn't it so that the steel itself is fairly unaffected by salt water, but the alox liners suffer?

All the corroded SAKs I've seen, the liners were in bad shape, rivets too, but the tools pristine.
Better steel wouldn't help here.

To all people working in salty conditions:
Buy a golden Climber 2016.
It costs more since it's limited edition, but has nickel silver liners instead of alox.