Just picked up a Buck 112!

[mikekoz]

I'll agree with eveyone else the edge just hasn't been apexed yet. So a little work is still needed.
Lanske makes a Diamond/Ceramic 4-Rod Turn Box, that would be a good set up for someone new to sharpening.

Stay away from the powered systems until you have more experience.
And never use a pull thru sharpener.

      Thanks! That looks promising, unfortunately I already ordered a new pull through model with adjustable sharpening angles made by Smiths. My current one works so well I figured it would be a step up!. I may order this also! The price is right. I decided to not get into the powered model I was looking at as I just did not want to invest that much $$$ into one at this time.

[mikekoz]

I also have one of these at home...

https://www.amazon.com/Shopline-Sharpener-Portable-Retractable-Sharpening/dp/B01J14X0GG/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=retractable+rod+sharpener&qid=1565964707&s=gateway&sr=8-2

I never really learned how to use it. Any opinions on this type of sharpener?

[Nix]

Mike,

I like the diamond rod sharpeners for field use. I carry these in my hunting pack:




The diamond rod is a bit aggressive, so a light touch is required. The Spyderco Double Stuff sharpening stone is outstanding. The fine ceramic side (white, shown) can put a very nice edge on just about any knife.

For me, the diamond rod gets used rarely. It is mostly there to clean up a small chip or roll in an edge. By itself, in my hands, it can put a good toothy edge on a knife fairly quickly. But for a razor's edge I use the Spyderco sharpener. Both of these can be used to sharpen a big knife. The trick there is to keep the kife still and move the stone/rod and work in sections.

So, in my view, diamond rods are great as rescue tools, but for routine sharpening, I like a good whetstone or water stone in an 8" size or better. 

[mikekoz]

OK! So it looks like I need to learn how to use a whetstone! I can pick this up on my way home....

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Tri-Hone-Sharpening-System/19426951

Looks good to me, but wanted to ask  the experts! I am actually pretty excited to learn how to use a stone. I may actually expand my horizons!! 

[Rapidray]

It does look good - standing by myself...

[Aloha]

I'm also gonna get one of those diamond rod sharpening tools.  I think they'll be great on serrated blades.  As far as your Arkansas stones you're getting  .  Take your time and you should do just fine.  I have a couple dual stones and a diamond plate.  Diamonds are pretty aggressive so I only use those to remove serious damage or a total re bevel.  There are quite a few great videos on using stones but I find practice make you better once you get the fundamentals down. 

Try it out on some kitchen knives first to see how well those stones remove material. 

[mikekoz]

   OK! I got the Smith's Tri-hone Sharpening System and am going to use a few old steak knives for guinea pigs!  First of all, is there a trick or a gadget to keep the knife blade at a steady sharpening angle? I see some systems on Amazon that came with one to attach to the back end of  the blade. The Smith's just comes with a guide for a 20 degree angle, but that is all it is. It does not stay on the blade itself For me, this may not be too helpful. Secondly, I also got a Smith's adjustable angle pull through sharpener.  It adjusts from 14 to 24 degrees. I ordered this before I got the bug to use the stones. The sharpener came with a chart that gave the factory sharpening angle for many brands and types of knives. It shows that Buck sets theirs to 13-16. However, when I search online for suggestions for the 112, the answers are all over the place from 12 to 30. I tried the adjustable pull through a few times set to 16 and 20 and it made a little bit of a difference, but nothing real noticeable. I am guessing that even though the manufacturer sets them a certain way in the factory, this could be a personal preference.  I really appreciate everybody's help on this so far! 

[Nix]

Personal preference, I think.

A leaner edge....say 13º...feels better to me. But a heartier edge...like 20º...is a bit more durable. Since I don't mind sharpening, I usually go with a more acute, lean edge. For a 'chopper' I'd go with a beefier, more obtuse edge. Think fillet knife vs axe.

Now, I don't actually measure my angles. I just eyeball the existing edge and decide if I like it or not. If I like it, I'll try to maintain that edge. If not, I pull out the coarse stone and grind it to my liking.  "Hey, that looks, feels right."

There are two schools of thought or techniques when it comes to freehand sharpening:

1. Hold the knife exactly the same way and at exactly the same angle for the entire sharpening process in order to produce a perfect 'V' grind or edge. Doing so produced wonderfully sharp knives capable of 'whittling a single hair'. This is tough to do freehand....assuming you aren't a robot. So a guide can be useful. Lansky-type systems are designed to take the human out of the equation and the stone works at a fixed angle across the edge. Great results.

2. Don't worry so much about a fixed angle and work the knife fluidly across the stone. This results in a rounded 'convex' edge or secondary bevel. There is still a sense of maintaining a consistent angle, but the emphasis is more on consistent motion than a consistent angle. I think a convexed secondary bevel (micro-convex) stays sharp longer, but never quite gets as wicked sharp as a pure V-grind edge (think Scandi, for example). With a convexed edge, there is more metal supporting the edge.  (But I may be full of Bull, here.)


Depending on the knife, and what I want, I use both techniques. However, at my skill-level, I find that all my edges end up with a bit of a micro-convex edge no matter how much I try to do a perfect 'V-grind'. Even my Scandi's end up with a tiny convexed edge. I'm only human.

One exception are my straight razors. I shave with a straight razor. When sharpening that, the blade rests on the stone with both the edge and spine touching the stone. So the spine (fairly thick) works as a guide and sets a consistent angle. When I sharpen chisels, I try to keep the bevel side as flat as I can...but I still end up with a micro-convex. (I probably need to practice more.) Some people recommend using a guide to sharpen your chisels to prevent convexing the edge. So, no doubt, a guide can help you maintain a consistent angle (if that's what you want).

However, I find it is more fun to just pick up a stone and hone the edge. Using a guide seems like a hassle to me. So I just live with a slight convex on all my knives. (Which seems to work fine. I have a few knives that are true convex edges and they are wonderful slicers.) Samurai swords were given a convex edge, so that can't be all bad......

My advice is this: start by trying to use technique #1 (keep a consistent angle). Use the guide on the Smith's stone as a starting point and then, purely freehand, try to maintain that 20º angle. Once you develop that hand skill and muscle-memory (may take a while), then try experimenting with other angles. 20º seems a bit obtuse to me (Buck sets their angles at 13-16º, reportedly). An alternative would be to make a small wooden wedge at 15-16º and use that as a starting point. Paint the edge of your blade with a Sharpie so you can see what you are doing. Apply more Sharpie as you wear it off. 

Once you feel reasonably comfortable with that, then take a look at technique #2 (consistent motion, inconsistent angle). Technique #2 is my preferred method. I just try to 'feel' the edge as I go and continue to work that until it feels smooth and sharp. You'll begin to be able to feel where the edge is a little rough or dull on the stone. Listen to the sound of the edge on the stone, that can also give you information about how the edge is being honed. Technique #2 probably ends up removing more steel than is necessary, so that's a draw back. And it can lead to sloppy sharpening, a bigger draw back. So I tihnk it's a good idea to start with Technique #1.    (And technique #1 probably gives the absolute keenest edge.)

Paint your edge with Sharpie and take some photos as you go. If you run into difficulty (which you most likely will), post a picture or two and ask some questions. 

[Aloha]

I always use a sharpie to mark the edge.  Make a pass on the stone and you'll instantly know if you hit the mark.  Some people can hold a steady angle across the entire edge but a slight variance wont hurt.  What I do, is make  enough passes on one side holding the angle ( sharpie is removed with first pass ) to create a burr on the opposite side.  I  count the passes.  I then mark the other side or sometimes just make a pass holding the knife at the same angle as the first to remove burr then mark.  I'll make the same number of passes on that side.  Before I move to the next finer stone I'll go back to the first side and remove the burr by lightly making one pass. 

Same process for the next stone.  Mark with sharpie and make passed till a burr is formed on the opposite side.  A light hand is best.  I always follow up with stropping.  You can use any leather to make a few passes to remove any burr from both sides.  You can now test on paper, arm hair. or whatever you feel.

My stones require a 10-15 min soak in water ( usually til no more bubbles ).  I sharpen near my sink so I always splash my stones a few times when using them.


My Buck is 17 degree per side but using the Lansky its likely closer to Bucks specs.   

[Rapidray]

Got a call yesterday evening and picked it up today!

[toolguy]

Got a call yesterday evening and picked it up today!

What is it?

[mikekoz]

Got a call yesterday evening and picked it up today!

   Nice! I was looking at one of those on Amazon. Thought it was a great deal at about $90.00 for a US made knife with S30V steel!

[Nix]

Great looking 112, Ray.   

Don't they just feel great in hand?   

[Rapidray]

What is it?

The G-10 Pro

[Rapidray]

Great looking 112, Ray.   

Don't they just feel great in hand?   

It does feel good and the weight is nice for the size. But I will be sending it back to the factory as the pin is sticking up and catches my skin. The knife blade also doesn’t drop easily when the lever is depressed. The snap back to closing is week.
I am starting to loose faith on ordering on line or thru the a shop as I did with this one. I either see it in person and then buy or I will just wait till I see it.
I sent the GEC back to the factory because it is so hard to open it was breaking my nail. 

[Nix]

Ah, I'm sure Buck will clean it up for you. I don't think any of my Bucks (112 or 110) swing open or shut when the lock lever is actuated. Defintely not like a Benchmade Axis lock or Spyderco Compression lock.

[SteveC]

They don't have a lot of closing snap either, at least mine doesn't

[Rapidray]

Ah, I'm sure Buck will clean it up for you. I don't think any of my Bucks (112 or 110) swing open or shut when the lock lever is actuated. Defintely not like a Benchmade Axis lock or Spyderco Compression lock.

Got a hammer after watching a YouTube and started tapping and after getting the hang of it added more swing to it. Strong pins! Ok now and the closing is at least snapping close at the end part of it. Will keep it and see how it goes. Thanks.

[Rapidray]

They don't have a lot of closing snap either, at least mine doesn't

Guess I have gotten so use to knives ‘walking and talking’ I expected it to do the same. Thanks for your experience on it also! 

[sak60]

The G-10 Pro

Looks nice.

[Rapidray]

Looks nice.

Thanks

[mikekoz]

  I have had little to no luck sharpening this knife. I did the Sharpie test on it, and from what I can tell, the sharpening angle on it is around  16 degrees. I sharpened it about 20 minutes using the Smith Tri-hone system using the coarse and fine stones but it is pretty much as dull as it was when I started. One thing I should have done is bought stones that were at least 8 inches. The 6 inch ones seem too short. I am looking at a 10" system on Amazon, but do not want to put that kind of money into this knife right now. I am going to return the set I got at Walmart and just put the knife aside for now. There are several places around the area where I live that offer sharpening, so I may look into that. Thanks again to everybody for their help!

[Rapidray]

Sorry to hear that. 

[Aloha]

It takes practice but more importantly knowing when to stop.  Glad you didn't keep at it frustrating yourself and possibly ruing the blade.   

[VICMAN]

Mike,

I like the diamond rod sharpeners for field use. I carry these in my hunting pack:

Nice combo Nix!

[VICMAN]

I mainly use these sharpening rods and steels for my knives. The steels just realign the edge without removing any metal, so once I have established an edge with a sharpener I normally use the steel regularly to maintain the edge so I don't have to remove any more metal.

I use the larger sharpener and steel for most of my knives. I use the small sharpener and steel for serrated edges.

When using a sharpener or steel start with moderate pressure and gradually lighten up the pressure as the blade becomes sharper, using only the weight of the knife for pressure at the last. This will allow you to get a very sharp edge. Before I learned about lightening the pressure until you are just using the weight of the knife for the final strokes, I used to end up getting a pretty good edge and then ruining it with the last few strokes by using too much pressure. For me at least this was a key to getting the edge I wanted.

I normally use my pocket steel on all my new knives to bring them to a hair shaving edge.

What actually happens when a blade starts to get dull is that the edge gets wavy and by using the steel you are just realigning the edge before it dulls to the point of needing to remove metal to sharpen it by using a diamond rod or stone.

If you don't have a steel and are cutting cardboard you can strop the blade on a piece of cardboard by dragging the edge backwards across the cardboard alternating sides as you do it and that will help to reallign it until you can get to a steel. If you have ever seen someone strop a straight razor it is the same method.

For serrated knives I use the small tapered diamond sharpener. I use the smallest part of the taper and rake it back and forth lengthwise over the serrations and then use a stroke lengthwise on the back side to knock off the burr and I finish with the small steel lightly back and forth and then use a stroke lengthwise on the backside for the final stroke.

Click on picture for best picture

[VICMAN]

The G-10 Pro

Very nice 112 G-10 Pro Rapidray!

[Rapidray]

Very nice 112 G-10 Pro Rapidray!

Thank you! 

[Nix]

Sorry for the frustration, Mike.

If the edge is really buggered, it can take a lot of work to bring it back. I had a small chip in a blade once and it seemed like I would never get that thing ground out. And I was using a coarse stone! So it goes.

At this point, why not send the knife back to Buck to get tuned up. Explain how you got it and that you've had trouble putting a good edge back on it. I betcha Buck gets it back to you in top shape. It will cost you shipping and maybe a nominal service fee, but it wold be worth it to start with a fresh edge. 

[mikekoz]

Sorry for the frustration, Mike.

If the edge is really buggered, it can take a lot of work to bring it back. I had a small chip in a blade once and it seemed like I would never get that thing ground out. And I was using a coarse stone! So it goes.

At this point, why not send the knife back to Buck to get tuned up. Explain how you got it and that you've had trouble putting a good edge back on it. I betcha Buck gets it back to you in top shape. It will cost you shipping and maybe a nominal service fee, but it wold be worth it to start with a fresh edge. 

    Thanks! I may just do that, but want to try using a stone system (10" ) to sharpen it one more time. I am even looking a a system made by Lansky that looks interesting. I have NOT given up on it!!