Tool perception - have we got it wrong?

[AimlessWanderer]

Just a little inane ramble of a tired mind ….

Last night I got thinking about thinking. Do we over think our tool choices? Are some tools REALLY as good as we think in comparison to other manufacturers/models? Are others REALLY as bad as we perceive them to be?

This started when I got my Juice KF4 and Vic Timekeeper yesterday. I eagerly opened them up and realised afterwards I had looked them over more with the mindset of a tool critic rather than just being happy I had got a new thing (or two) and wondering how well they will be in my daily activities. "The handles pinch a little, but then it’s an older model with heads stamped USA, 2001 date codes blah blah blah". I dug out my (much chastised) CS4 as a comparison, and found that all of a sudden I didn’t hate it quite as much as I had before.  The CS4 was a massive disappointment for me when I got it, but mainly due to what I got in comparison to the money spent rather than just the tool alone. The cost element has now depleted as it’s a while since I got it, and what remains is a tool which is …. well it’s alright I suppose. Not the greatest engineering triumph known to man, but is it REALLY as bad as I thought back then? I’d have probably been very happy with it indeed if it only cost me £25, but it cost much more and that’s probably where most of the venom came from.

I then started thinking about the tool which started me off down this line, a Gerber Suspension, my first ever pliers based multitool. I thought it was pretty poor even though I had nothing to compare it with back then, and knew very little about other tools. That said, there were a few times when I needed “something” to do a task and the Suspension was the only thing to hand. Needless to say the task was completed, the world didn’t fall off its axis and all my fingers and toes were still attached. I decided I would try to go for a while, maybe even a month or so, with my CS4 to see whether I can get past my initial views and see how it fares when it’s all I’ve got (Although in fairness I will probably still have my Swisstool in my bag if things go squiffy)

Generally speaking I am biased towards certain tools and manufacturers and biased against others. I am also convinced that I am not alone with this. How many guys prefer Leatherman because of their own mindset rather than the tools itself? Quite a few I’d guess. Hype, branding, group psychology, patriotism? This was why I have a tendency to be overly critical of LM, because to me they have prove themselves more to overcome my aversion to “hype” (probably the wrong word, but it’ll do for now). Then again I’m generally biased towards Victorinox in much the same way, and find it hard to view any of their tools badly in comparison with other designs or manufacturers. Hypocritical - nah, just honest   

Anyone else brave enough to say their tool choices could be done with a more open mind? Sometimes it’s not easy to be open minded, prejudice is a natural survival instinct we all carry otherwise our species would be long gone. I’m pretty sure I don’t need my survival instincts taking over if I’m choosing what MT I’m putting in my pocket in a morning though. They sure make things much easier than bashing stuff with rocks tied on sticks.

BTW … I really like the Vic Timekeeper … and the KF4 too
 

[Zed]

Ive been in this same thought Al, ive tried most MT's and many SAK's. for me personaly a pocket knife has served me well over the years , i never use a tin/bottle opener but a sharp blade has come in handy lots of times, my wave has been a very handy companion n many camping trips and on sites over the years so a keeper as far as im concerned, we all have our favourites on here and its nice to try out many of them when possible but i know what works for me and these days i generally stick to them, ive pretty much gone fall circle now and happy with what i have for my general EDC 

[Chako]

An interesting topic to be sure.

I can honestly say, I have tried most MTs out there. I have even EDCed a good variety during my holidays to know what I like and what I don't like. I am governed above all by a good streak of practicality however, and thus, I am relegated to the Leatherman Knifeless Fuse due to work restrictions for 10 months out of the year. The other two months does leave me with some experimenting, and of course weekends as well.

I can also say I am not prejudiced in any way shape or form when it comes down to multi-tools. I enjoy well made, well engineered  tools. I dislike the opposite. This means I will go to bat for even the cheap  Chinese items that meet those criteria, even taking into consideration the retail price for what you get. I am no tool snob.

I suppose I am blessed. I know I can only wear knifeless items at work, so I don't worry about the rest. Heaven knows I have a good tool selection to choose from, but due to work restrictions, I don't worry about tool selection because I can't wear most of it anyways. Makes life simple...which is something I enjoy very much.

[airballrad]

I definitely have my biases, and my tool ownership reflects that. I buy mostly Leatherman tools because I like them best. However, I recognize that this is as much (or more) aesthetics as function; my first MT was a PST. I have friends who EDC'd Gerber tools in the mid-90's, and they are still strident Gerber fans today, even though they may not have purchased a MT in 15 years and have no idea what is available today. I have a couple Gerbers (love my MP600), and a couple SOGs (compound leverage and a killer leather sheath), and someday I want a SwissTool (or 3). But I will always focus on LM the most.

[MeadMaker]

This topic touches on a realization that I had a couple weeks ago.

I have never liked SAK's for no good reason.  I have never owned one or even carried one.  But, when I look at them, something inside me says "Not for me".

On the other hand I am a big fan of Leathermans.  My first was a Juice S2 and I've like the Leatherman products ever since.

There are a lot of forum members here that are passionate about their SAK's so Victorinox and Wenger must be doing something right, but I didn't feel good about them and  I couldn't put my finger the the source of my prejudice against SAK's.

I started thinking about the first knives that I had as a kid.  My favorite was a Camillus Cub Scout knife.  It had a stout carbon main blade and was hefty.  The disappointing knives that I had back then were cheaply built, had highly polished blades and were light in weight.  The light went on above my head and I realized that my impression of SAK's was misplaced.  While SAK's and the disappointing knives of my youth both have highly polished blades and were light weight, but the similarities end there. 

Recently I found a Victorinox Adventurer at a local store mis-marked at $12.95. That particular model isn't appropriate for my EDC needs, but at that price it couldn't be passed up.  I grabbed it up and have been pleased with the quality of the knife.

I will still carry my trusty Juice, but SAK's offer one advantage over the LM's.  The scales are easily changed.  I'm working on a set of maple scales for the Adventurer now.  After I get the process figured out, I'll move on to more attractive wood and more SAK's.

[82brutus]

... Heaven knows I have a good tool selection to choose from...

Heaven's not the only one that knows you have a good tool selection... we've all seen the pictures.   

From my perspective, sometimes it is most definitely the deal I got which makes the tool seem more favorable. 

It's been much more difficult for me to get a good deal on Leatherman stuff because brand name wise, they pretty much dominate the market.  Not to say that it isn't justified in that Leatherman does a very good job of advertising and backing up their warranty.   

I haven't had to test out Vic's warranty, but then maybe that says something about Vic products.  I have gotten quite a few good deals on Vics and even though I have found other items to EDC, sometimes I go back to the good deals because it gives me a warm feeling inside.   

[AimlessWanderer]

I have never liked SAK's for no good reason.  I have never owned one or even carried one.  But, when I look at them, something inside me says "Not for me".

I was like that for years. I just thought they were a bit naff and gimicky - I found it hard to take them seriously - again without ever trying one. It wasn't that long ago when I bought a vic tourist as my first SAK and realised how wrong I was ... there's been a few (ok, maybe slightly more than a few  ) added since then. 

An interesting topic to be sure.

I can honestly say, I have tried most MTs out there .... Heaven knows I have a good tool selection to choose from ...

I'll certainly not argue you are one of the more eclectic ones mate  So how many of your tools go on test drives? Interesting to see you've chosen (or had chosen for you  ) a knifeless fuse from your myriad of options ... I had wondered for a while how you'd go about chosing what to carry from your assortment. Looks like your job has saved you about 2 hours every morning and a fortune in headache pills   

But if you're choices weren't limited ....  
(definitely with you on the well made cheapies BTW  )

I definitely have my biases, and my tool ownership reflects that. I buy mostly Leatherman tools because I like them best. However, I recognize that this is as much (or more) aesthetics as function; my first MT was a PST. I have friends who EDC'd Gerber tools in the mid-90's, and they are still strident Gerber fans today, even though they may not have purchased a MT in 15 years and have no idea what is available today. I have a couple Gerbers (love my MP600), and a couple SOGs (compound leverage and a killer leather sheath), and someday I want a SwissTool (or 3). But I will always focus on LM the most.

I will say this for LM, they certainly make sure they give you plenty of options. I also have more LM's than any other maker (not counting SAK's) at the mo, purely down to me exploring different options (although I the number may drop a bit soon) - so I've not been TOO closed minded in my purchases I suppose, mainly just in my tool use and appraisal. I've also been lucky in getting most of my LM's in great deals/trades with members here - I wouldn't have tried to get them otherwise.

[Gareth]

  It's a fair point and well made.  I honestly try and look for the good points in any new multi I get (and am often quite forgiving) while at the same time I try not to be blind to any issues.  I also try and separate any 'issues' into various category's; poorly designed, cheaply made, design compromise, cost compromise etc.  Helps keep things in perspective IMO.
 
If you've noticed the word 'try' in that last paragraph a few times then it's because I also acknowledge that gut reaction plays a huge part.  My first multi was a Supertool and I loved it, next was a PST and I was really disappointed.   Looking back my reaction was certainly partly due to the well documented drawbacks with the PST, but mostly it was just the fact it wasn't my beloved Supertool.  Do note that I have managed to forgive the PST for it's shortcomings (even though I do prefer the PST II) but I have yet to feel the love for my Skeletool or PPP.
 

[AimlessWanderer]

Thanks mate  I think that comparison you made to a previously owned tool is a good point actually.

I liked the SOG Powerlock, but it was too big to carry and I wasn't convinced about some of the tools. The PPP gave me a pocketable version with the best (for me) of the tool set and no handle covers - so I liked it. If I had got the PPP first, would I have liked it the same  Maybe the fact I couldn't connect with the Pulse was I hadn't spent time toting round and using a PST (or similar) for a while to feel the "benefits" of the Pulse  Would I have had such strong issues with the CS4 if I hadn't had SAK's first  I've not tried a Skele ... but it wouldn't be something I'd reach for anyway with the other options I've got.

Well day one of CS4 carry completed, and fingers and toes all present and accounted for. I'm actually looking forward to trying to recalibrate my views on tools, and seeing whether my favourites and biases change. Must remember to pick up a battery for my Timekeeper so I can let that out for some fresh air!

@ Chako - Do you have any favourite tools (for carry) when you're not bound to the knifeless fuse?

[Chako]

Well I can honestly tell you it won't be the Gerber Recoil anytime soon. 

Hmmm...

I am partial to these tools in no given order.

Leatherman Super Tool 200/300.
Leatherman PST II.
Leatherman Pulse.
Gerber Freehand.
Gerber MP600.
Victorinox SwissTool X.
SOG PowerLock.
Bear & Son Super Bear Jaws.

[turnsouth]

I've never met a tool that I didn't like 

That being said, I do indeed have my preferences. And they run the gamut, Leatherman, Vic, Sharade (the old one), Kershaw, etc...

And in fairness, I always give every tool the chance to try and measure up to the power of the
 

[Styerman]

I my Multi buying reflects my other tool buying . I buy the best I can afford , and most suited for the task .

99% of what I ACTUALLY do , could be handled by a SAK like an Alox Soldier or Tinker Small .

Chris

[Mr. Whippy]

My tools get "Farm Duty Beatdowns".  If I have to go to a back up of some sort, or the tool fails based on its design, then it heads out of rotation for the long term.

Some examples:

Vic SwissTool Spirit:  Beautiful mirror like finish, lovely click into place tools.  However, add grease, oil, diesel fuel, etc and suddenly that ultrasmooth finish makes the tool nearly impossible to handle.  No pocket clip.

SOG PowerPliers:  Love the compound leverage but, the other tools in the handle bend with the slightest sideways pressure.  The little spring on the 1/4 driver is a little to fiddly for work in a pasture (try to find that in the grass).

Spyderco Spyderench:  The pliers fall apart way too easily. Enough said.


Basically, I need a tool to just work when I FINALLY get the pieces lined up, I have to hold them in place and blindly grab for the tool to fix them in place.  No drama from the tool.    Generally, that's what I get from the LM Charge/wave series (and as well as the original PST and Skeletool).

Btw, the Juice series fails mainly because the flat drivers are a pain to get out (literally if you're not careful  )

[AimlessWanderer]

My tools get "Farm Duty Beatdowns".  If I have to go to a back up of some sort, or the tool fails based on its design, then it heads out of rotation for the long term.

Perfect! It either works or it doesn't! Just how tool selection should be 

I'm with you on the Spirit, I love mine to bits - but there's no way I could even try to use it at work. That role is reserved for the Wave. I've not found any other folding pliers that work better in that environment (perpetual grease and grime). I caught myself reaching for the CS4 earlier today and thought better of it. I'd feel the same about taking the Spirit to the boat. If that slips out of my hand it could be a very expensive day - but at least down there I can go for Swissgrip as I don't need to pocket carry. Again, best in role for me from what I've handled (wet hands, oils and greases and unforgiving tasks) - but does occasionally need needlenose accompanyment from time to time I've discovered. It's away from these areas where things get a little fuzzy for me, and can be vulnerable to being ... biased? blinkered? narrow minded? (I really need to get some sleep)

I agree on the Juice drivers too. I must remember to take a diamond file to the flat drivers to soften the corners a smidge. I'd rather risk having a driver slip occasionally than take a bite out of my finger everytime I go rooting through them.

[AimlessWanderer]

I've never met a tool that I didn't like 

That being said, I do indeed have my preferences. And they run the gamut, Leatherman, Vic, Sharade (the old one), Kershaw, etc...

And in fairness, I always give every tool the chance to try and measure up to the power of the (Image removed from quote.)
 

Not even a Gerber ... *ducks for cover*   

Out of interest, how early in your MT timeline did you get the Core? Was that your first heavy duty multi?

[turnsouth]

I've never met a tool that I didn't like 

Not even a Gerber ... *ducks for cover*   

While I never found Gerber's to be my cup of tea, it's not that I don't like them. I suppose that if there were no other tools on earth...

And I do keep a Radius in my collection, mostly so I can see the "What the Smurf!" look on people's faces, when I hand it to them.

Out of interest, how early in your MT timeline did you get the Core? Was that your first heavy duty multi?

I started with one original ST, and when the ST200 came out, I got about a half a dozen to keep in handy places (Cars, BOB, tool box, EDC. My daughter still has one in her glove box.) When I got my first Core (I think it was a replacement for a broken ST200 I sent to LM) I was hooked. Been trying out the ST300, but I'm not sure if its new features will overcome its shortcomings when compared to the Core. Time will tell...

[grimm_kaosboy]

Honestly, when it comes to being biased FOR tools Victorinox gets the nod. Now I own several makes and models but Vic hands down has proven itself in real life situations to do what needs to be done, without failure while being pleasing to the eye. Or my eye anyways. Mind you the only tool I have ever managed to break was a Swisstool, but then again I dont think it was engineered to use the scraper as a chisel. Being hit by a five pound sledge. For five years. I guess it earned its failure.
Now when it comes to being biased AGAINST tools...I just don't care for Wengers. There I said it.  Nothing wrong with 'em I guess, just not for me.

[theonew]

I'm pretty new to Leatherman tools having only picked up my first non-keychain sized one, a KF4, several months ago. I loved it when I got it and still love it. Then I got a Charge TTI and really loved it. Then I got all the bits and accessories and loved it even more. Then I got a Swisstool Spirit X and was blown away by the craftsmanship    As nice as the Charge is, it just seems frumpy compared to the Swisstool. But when I started carrying the Spirit, I missed having all those Leatherman bits and the few special hardware store bits I keep with it, I also missed the pocket clip and the one hand opening blades, and the cutting hook, and the wider opening pliers. So I went back to carrying the Charge, in an urban environment it just seems more practical. But I love Victorinox knives very much and would feel naked without one, so I always have a Farmer or Super Tinker or OHT with me as well. I just got a Vic Explorer and am loving this tool, forgot how useful and fun it is to have a magnifying glass. So basically it's primarily about practicality for me. The Spirit is better made and each implement is a work of art, but for me the Charge wins for it's functionality and convenience.

[AimlessWanderer]

Mind you the only tool I have ever managed to break was a Swisstool, but then again I dont think it was engineered to use the scraper as a chisel. Being hit by a five pound sledge. For five years. I guess it earned its failure.

  What a magnificent way to void a warranty  :

I'm pretty new to Leatherman tools having only picked up my first non-keychain sized one, a KF4, several months ago. I loved it when I got it and still love it. Then I got a Charge TTI and really loved it. Then I got all the bits and accessories and loved it even more. Then I got a Swisstool Spirit X and was blown away by the craftsmanship    As nice as the Charge is, it just seems frumpy compared to the Swisstool. But when I started carrying the Spirit, I missed having all those Leatherman bits and the few special hardware store bits I keep with it, I also missed the pocket clip and the one hand opening blades, and the cutting hook, and the wider opening pliers. So I went back to carrying the Charge, in an urban environment it just seems more practical. But I love Victorinox knives very much and would feel naked without one, so I always have a Farmer or Super Tinker or OHT with me as well. I just got a Vic Explorer and am loving this tool, forgot how useful and fun it is to have a magnifying glass. So basically it's primarily about practicality for me. The Spirit is better made and each implement is a work of art, but for me the Charge wins for it's functionality and convenience.

Interesting! I prefer the Spirit for "clean" carry, and the Wave for dirty work. I don't think the Swisstool or Spirit have ever left me wanting in an urban setting., I do wish the Spirit had a proper lanyard attachment though (i.e. on the end) so it would work with a suspension clip. I find suspension clips safer as the tool is wholly within the pocket and the smaller clip draws less attention

[jerseydevil]

Like theonew, I'm pretty new to the carrying a Leatherman/Gerber/whatever. For years, my everyday tool was my Vic Tinker. My LM Blast saw only light use, even though a set of pliers is occasionally very useful at work. I would have been perfectly happy with that set up, but NO! I had to find this site when, on a whim, I got a Wenger SI and was looking for info about it. Nowadays, me setup at work is either my Kick or Wave on my hip, and a SAK of some sort in my pocket. Occasionally I'll carry my MP450, which I was nervous about first using, judging from what I had read here about Gerber. Shows how wrong I was, the MP450 is a great little tool and I'm very happy with it. As far as SAKs go, that Tinker turned into 12 all of a sudden, ranging from a Classic to the OH Trekker I just received today. My idea on tools seems to be if it looks neat, it's mine. No drawer queens here though, everything in the collection had seen its share of carry time. The plus for me is that whatever tool I'm carrying, it works for what I need it for and that's all I require.

[theonew]

I find suspension clips safer as the tool is wholly within the pocket and the smaller clip draws less attention

I've read a few posts here recently extolling the virtues of the suspension clip and I'm definitely interested. In NYC any visibly clipped tool is likely to draw the attention of the NYPD, not sure if completely buried in the pocket makes any difference as opposed to sticking out slightly. But I do like to clip my Charge to my pocket when I'm in the office, on a job on private property or outside of the city, which constitutes a good deal of my time. I can see what you mean about the safety factor of the suspension clip but I would have to try one first to know about the comfort. The biggest drawback I can see with the suspension clip is that it makes removing and using the tool just a bit more fiddly.

My idea on tools seems to be if it looks neat, it's mine.

Reminds me of a bumper sticker I just saw on a woman's car, "If the shoe fits ... I own it"

[GraysonK]

I had an "ah ha" moment like this not too long ago.  I wouldn't call myself a "snob" toward any particular brand, but I am picky, I think.  I was going through my stuff the other night, cleaning, sharpening, etc and realized that I'm a creature of habit and I just might be boring.   
I realized that most of the stuff I have that I really like or really really LOVE are kind of standard look and fucntion.  The reason I prefer the Pulse to the Wave is the way it looks and that phillips screwdriver.  Now, on function and ease of use, if I'm outside working on something especially if I can only use one hand, then the Wave is the tool I want.  But for everything else, I'd grab the Pulse.  It's got a classic, no nonsense, no frill design in my opinion and that's what I like.  Same thing with my SAK's.  The only one in my collection that I'm not particularly fond of is the Cybertool 34...mainly because it's actually too fiddly for me.  I also wasn't overly fond of the Helmsman until I realized just how useful that particular SAK is. 
99% of the time I use a SAK.  I love my case pocket knives and my spydies but really  a SAK takes care of almost anything I get into on a day to day basis.  And I've tried other multifunction pocket knives but they just don't "feel" right and don't look right.  I guess I'm just a little biased on the looks and the feel of the tool. 

[AimlessWanderer]

I had yet another perspective change last night, this time with SOG tools (or should I say parts). I've shot them down in the past for not being as good as other manufacturers, but I was sat down last night looking at a few tools I'd stripped right down and realised how the SOG tools are actually a really very viable alternative.

For example the file might not be diamond coated, but that screwdriver tip could make all the difference to configuring a versatile load out, as could the drivers on the can opener/cap lifter rather than the plain drivers on early LM's. Drivers tend to be my least used tools so carrying say a standard Kick which is just drivers, a knife (again I don't use MT blades much) and a can/bottle opener just seems silly for my needs. I still think the SOG saw is still ridiculously short though, just as the awl is still excellent. Again, that might not apply if I was doing different things everyday

I'm quite enjoying re-discovering all these tools with a more open mind. I'm not sure the CS4 will remain EDC at the end of this trial though (pity I can't swap that saw for a file as easily as on a full sized LM), but I really need to consider varying my tool choices and challenging my mindset more often anyway.

[AimlessWanderer]

Thread necro 

The CS4 was indeed carried for a month and I got by, but as soon as that month was up I started carrying something else and I don't think I ever carried it again. I ended up gifting it to my younger brother as I knew he'd get more use out of it and despite it's weaknesses and failings it was better than the really naff tools he had before.

He works in a care environment as a support worker, but often has to attend to a few maintenance tasks during a working day, and is also responsible for the electrical PAT testing at a couple of sites. He carries the CS4 everyday without fail, along with a Wenger Evo 14 which I also hated and gifted him.

I saw him last night and he said there's rarely a day goes by that he doesn't use one or both of them and he absolutely loves them. He started recalling times he's used them .... and he's getting some real milage out of both tools. He's won favour with the management at three residential sites in the city purely because he's not "just" a support worker in their eyes, and despite being in such a sensitive environment not one of the managers has flinched at his tool carry as they've all benefitted from it

I'm glad the tools found a new lease of life even though I couldn't abide them, and happier my kid brother is going round with legal tools in his pocket and the ability/mindset to use them safely

Bottom line, the tool which was a diabolical attempt riddled with annoyance for me is absolutely perfect pocket tool for him, and he's not got a single gripe about it

[Zed]

Funny reading this one as again things change over time, i for money issues had to sell a lot of my MT's last year and decided to have a non LM year plus try different makes and models, so far ive tried the paratool, for now and then use i found it ok but it bugged me while on my handyman job,way too fiddly but still a nice tool, i got to liking the changable and moddable tool loads,so now onto the PPP after a trade for the pt with Allan, so far this tool is more what im after in a MT good size smooth action,plenty of drivers (hence my lover for the days of my old wave lol) plus the little bitdriver that allan sent with it goes on the large flat head (io do love a bit holder  ) i do agree that i look at MT's and SAK's in a much different way these days but im after the perfect MT and perfect SAK, it been a long road  but fun 

Ive enjoyed all of this stuff,the ppp to find out .

[Mr. Whippy]

I feel very fortunate in that I don't have to sell the tools that I try and set aside.  Since the time of this original thread, I've decided that other than the Kf4, I don't really like the Juice series. 

My wife, on the other hand EDC's an S2 everyday and uses the holy hell out of it.

I find myself tending to carry SAK's when we are out socially and save Leatherman's for heavy duty farm time. 

With a cybertool 41 or S557, I'm pretty well covered for social events.  Heck, we were out with my in-laws the other evening, and my mother in law had a few loose threads that were annoying her.  My wife was about to go after them with a steak knife  ,  when I said, "Wait, why don't you try this?" and handed her the Cybertimer 41 with scissors out.  Right after that, we needed a way to keep track of appetiziers and sidedishes we were ordering, and voila!  out came the little Vic pen. 

[Lynn LeFey]

I've had some amusement testing various bits on MTs. I don't think I have a bias, with one clear and notable exception. I have a positive bias toward the Crosscut from years of EDC. I understand that most of that is the 'it was the tool that was there when I needed it' thing, but there's no getting over that sometimes.

I always tie cost to the value of a tool, but try to realize a tool's potential even ignoring that. It doesn't always work. As Mr. Whippy just pointed out as well, a tool's perceived worth is also closely tied to the user's needs. The Juice might not do him any good, but his wife loves it for EDC.

I try not to have name-brand bias, either for or against, but I have to be honest in saying Gerber's stuff has consistently not thrilled me, and Victorinox has. There, I said it. The truth is that Gerber's stuff is consistently better than most knock-offs. And price seems to be about right to reflect that.

I've decided, since Vic's are all just combinations of a fairly small number of tools, they need to just make a set you can take apart and slap together in any combination you want, like the Quirky Switch. Bam... the perfect tool.

[Zed]

I've had some amusement testing various bits on MTs. I don't think I have a bias, with one clear and notable exception. I have a positive bias toward the Crosscut from years of EDC. I understand that most of that is the 'it was the tool that was there when I needed it' thing, but there's no getting over that sometimes.

I always tie cost to the value of a tool, but try to realize a tool's potential even ignoring that. It doesn't always work. As Mr. Whippy just pointed out as well, a tool's perceived worth is also closely tied to the user's needs. The Juice might not do him any good, but his wife loves it for EDC.

I try not to have name-brand bias, either for or against, but I have to be honest in saying Gerber's stuff has consistently not thrilled me, and Victorinox has. There, I said it. The truth is that Gerber's stuff is consistently better than most knock-offs. And price seems to be about right to reflect that.

I've decided, since Vic's are all just combinations of a fairly small number of tools, they need to just make a set you can take apart and slap together in any combination you want, like the Quirky Switch. Bam... the perfect tool.

This is a reason im vering towards sogs lynn,although it would be interesting to see what combo's folk have in there PPP's as seems limited, i added 2 extra to the PT but the pliers stuck out a little bit,it bothered me      although i do like the ppp's tool load and i swapped out the blade for a wood saw, i might stick up a post to see if any folk have altered there ppp's 

[Steinar]

I've decided, since Vic's are all just combinations of a fairly small number of tools, they need to just make a set you can take apart and slap together in any combination you want, like the Quirky Switch. Bam... the perfect tool.

Well... I suspect the current situation, where we buy the next one and next one and next one, because if just “that little thing” was different it would be “perfect” works out great for Vic. 

And, frankly, knives and MTs is something where I happily have loads of prejudices. It is one of the parts of life where I can partake of that luxury of going for what I like, not only what is optimal price/performance and good enough.

[Gryffin]

I've decided, since Vic's are all just combinations of a fairly small number of tools, they need to just make a set you can take apart and slap together in any combination you want, like the Quirky Switch. Bam... the perfect tool.

Nope, still wouldn't be perfect. Because the implements you need tomorrow could be different from the implements you need today. And if you add every implement you might need, you end up with a SwissChamp XL; you'll never find a perfect combination of size/weight vs. utility.

 

Again, that's what keeps Vic/Wenger churning out SAKs by the tractor-trailer-full!