I've been injured by a pitbull

[Grant Lamontagne]

For years I have been trying to promote pitbulls are actually friendly and non violent animals. After today I don't know if I can still do that since I was injured by a pitbull today.  Not seriously, although it could have been.

While at the dog park with Daisy today a pitbull, while chasing another dog around rammed it's rock hard skull right into my shin. The pitbull wasn't slowed a bit, but I have a large swollen lump on my shin that has turned some bizarre colors not normally found in nature.  And, it's extremely painful to the tough, something I discovered when Daisy tried to use me as a pillow while we watched TV this afternoon.

Now I am not calling for breed specific legislation or muzzling as I honestly think that is pretty well useless. I am thinking of starting a petition that ALL pitbulls be forced to wear inside out helmets- that is to say with the hard part inside and the padding outside, for the safety of society.

And while we are at it, maybe a dampening spring on those tails....

Def

[kirk13]

You had me worried when I looked at the thread.I think your being a bit unfair to the dog here,it was only trying to give you your birthday bumps!

[AHB]

We have had some pretty gruesome cases with Pitbull/muscle dog attacks here in Denmark the last years, so I've never been a fan.. There are a few races that have been marked as illegal and I'm not saying that the bad rep. is the dogs fault entirely, but from my pow it might not be the ideal "family" dog..

[Grant Lamontagne]

In all seriousness Allan, you'd be completely wrong if you suggested they are not the ideal family dog.  They were originally called nanny dogs because they are brilliant with children and extremely even tempered.  When the Little Rascals was being created they purposely included a pitbull as the dog because at the time they were considered the most wholesome breed.

There are two pitbulls in my building and both are the nicest, friendliest dogs you'd ever meet.  One was even involved in a serious biting incident before my tenants adopted her.  Fortunately she healed well and was taken away from the golden retreiver before it could cause her any serious harm.

Def

[Steinar]

Disclaimer: I'm pretty much in the “It's always the responsibility of the adult human(s) involved, stop blaming the dog” camp when it comes to injuries from dogs, so I have a tendency to take all stories about dog injuries with a grain of salt. When I was a kid, we sometimes were makeshift home for a dog with a lot of problems. A huge (for its breed) German shepherd (he stood 70 cm at the shoulder). After I got to know him, I could tell each and every time I witnessed an episode where a problem occurred, the dog tried to tell the human how he was going to react, but the human didn't understand. I suspect a lot of people today would have said that animal should be killed, but it would be... well... wrong. He was a good dog, he had just been treated too bad too many times. Surrounded by people he trusted, he was the gentlest, cuddliest creature you could imagine. He loved the vacuum cleaner for instance, he always wanted us to vacuum his fur. (And the only person ever hurt by that dog, was myself. The first time I met him, I didn't understand what he was trying to say, and before any adults reacted he had nipped me. In the throat. Just a couple of superficial rifts (not even bleeding as such). If he had wanted to hurt me, he could have ripped my throat out. He just wanted me to back down.)

Now, going further into politics: The discussions about legally controlling dog breeds reminds me a little bit too much about the discussions about restricting knives and multitools. I'm all for outlawing the breeding of unhealthy, mentally unstable animals, destined to live in pain (usually in the handbag of some shallow two-legged creature), but not healthy, happy animals with the possibility to contribute to their family. Just as I see no reason for people to own machine guns, while outlawing OH knives is plain stupid.

This became a longer, more rambling post than intended, but I think I miss dogs in my life.

Moderators: Delete at will if I crossed the politics line.

[Grant Lamontagne]

While I agree completely with you, I think we need to watch that this thread doesn't lose the lightheartedness it was intended for.

Def

[Steinar]

While I agree completely with you, I think we need to watch that this thread doesn't lose the lightheartedness it was intended for.

Let's rerail (that would be the opposite of derail, wouldn't it?) the thread:

Perhaps you should argue for long-haired pitbulls? That could cushion the impact from both the tail and the skull. Would make the tail more efficient for tearing down lights on Christmas trees and such, though.

[Grant Lamontagne]

Thanks.... I'd actually had to delete the vast majority of what I'd typed since this is a topic I take quite seriously and personally.

It was just lucky that I was standing very close to a very attractive woman when it happened or I'd have fallen down swearing.  Instead I just grit my teeth and laughed!

When Daisy tried to use me as a pillow a couple of hours later I realized just how nasty the impact was!

Def

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[sawman]

I my experience with several different pittbulls, they are the friendliest, most loving dogs you could find.  If I were in the market for a dog, I'd definitely consider one.

[Steinar]

Attractive women are very effective painkillers. Or rather, pain-hiders. Can be dangerous.

Def, I hope you didn't worry Daisy too much with your reaction when she wanted a grant-pillow.

[Grant Lamontagne]

She seems to be fine!  I took her out to play fetch a little while ago and fed her so she's about as content as she gets.

Def

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[MultiMat]

I think Def needed to ask for a set of cricket pads for his birthday 



Bruce our Kelpie cross tried to hump 3 different dogs today at obedience class this morning , Bruce is 'fixed' too  . Our other dog has a rather endearing trick of peeing on other owners legs whist we are not looking    . I am waiting for the "it's ok you don't need to come back next weeks class or the week after or ........" 

[Heinz Doofenshmirtz]

There is always a continuum between inborn/genetic influences on behavior, and the influence of environment/learning.  This is actually a subject I know a fair amount about, being a cognitive/physiological psychologist.  It does vary from species to species, and in some species, such as dogs, it also varies from breed to breed, as each breed has been artificially selected for particular traits.

That said, yes, pitbulls can be loving and affectionate animals, but at the same time, as with any other breed, they have some inherent genetic characteristics that don't sit well with them being a family dog.  In particular are their bite characteristics; they have a genetic predisposition to lock their jaws when they do bite, and that in itself presents a danger.  That behavior isn't something you can teach out of an animal, any more than you can teach predatory behavior out of a dog. 

Another example of an ingrained genetic behavior in dogs is seen in Border Collies; they have an exceptional ability to discriminate one object from another by verbal command only.  Several examples are known of Border Collies being taught the names for various objects, having those objects placed out of sight of the dog and the handler, and then the dog given a command to retrieve one of the objects by name, and they are exceptional at this.  Some other breeds of dogs can't even be trained to do this task.  It's been found that Border Collies have a set of codons in their genome that encodes for particular connections in their brain that highly correlate with this kind of learning, whereas most other breeds don't.  There was actually a segment on Nova: Science Now about this.

Personally, I dislike pitbulls, primarily because of their genetic bite and aggression characteristics, they are very easy to train to be fighting and attack dogs.  That is a big reason they have the reputation that they currently do, because that's what they're often trained to do. 

A few months ago there was an incident with a pitbull at the dog park near where I live; a pitbull was playing with another dog and locked its jaws on the muzzle of another dog and it took several minutes for the owner of the pitbull to get it to release the other dog.  I often take my wife's poodle and my four year old daughter to that park, but I'm always cautious when there is a pitbull there, no matter how much the owner professes it to be friendly, non-aggressive, etc.  I typically EDC my Endura 4, and in keeping with the sentiment of not getting to political about this topic, let me just say that because of what I've seen there, and because of what I know about animal behavior, genetics, and learning, I long ago decided that in a situation like what I witnessed before, especially if it were to involve my daughter, I would not hesitate for a moment to use the tools I have on hand to put an end to such a situation.  So, sorry for my saying this, and I know and acknowledge that pitbulls can be affectionate and loving dogs, they do have certain behaviors that simply can't be trained or taught away, and that is one reason I do not trust them when I am around them.

[Accujohn]

I don't trust them off a leash... Too many attacks in the news. Regardless of breed, human fault etc... Doesn't matter. Point is, if you don't know the dog or owner, and maybe even if you do, they can be a bit unpredictable. Like some other breeds. Love dogs btw

[captain spaulding]

Ahhh Heinz your killin me. I truly respect your opinion though.

[Stormdrane]

Used to have a friend about ten years ago that kept a couple of pitbulls.  I'd go down to his place in the fall to help clear out some brush on his property, cook out, and do some drinking after dark around a bonfire.  He kept one dog in a fenced kennel and the other on a staked out chain.  The chained dog, 'Red', would occasionally get loose and was suspected of killing a couple of the neighbors goats, across the road, but no one had specifically seen him do it. 

My friend opted to call the dog 'Killer' afterwards, but I strongly discouraged such a nickname.  I'd let him off his chain and he'd curl up at my feet around the fire, and later slept next to me in the back of my truck.  Red was solid muscle and I'd seen him jump a six foot chain link fence, but he was always a good dog around me, although I imagine his bark/growling with slobber flying at strangers could be a bit disconcerting. 

Both dogs had always been good around friends and family, but when a stranger would visit, they'd seem quite territorial and would either accept the new arrival with a sniff and a lick, or the complete opposite with not liking the newcomer at all and doing a 'Cujo' routine.  They'd either liked you or they didn't, lol... 

[Taxi Dad]

I used to have a couple of Dobermanns, another breed with a poor rep. which i never found to be true (quite the opposite in fact)
i have always found great benifit in getting all the dogs i've owned to be comfy wearing a 'muzzle', there are times that you want to be 100% sure they can't bite (ie vets visits, or if they are injured and therefore not themselves)
My 'female' Dobbie wasn't that keen on children when i got her, more due to bad soSmurfpillsation in her former life than bad temperament, and she often bared her teeth as a welcome grin (it LOOKED terrifying if you didn't spot the furiously wagging stump !) We would put this large stainless steal 'cage' over her face making her look quite scary (imagine Hannibal Lecter) and encouraged all the local kids to poke dog treats through the 'bars' to get her used to children. This caused it's own problems. She loved her muzzle on and would charge round with it on crashing into everything with what was just a shopping trolly without wheels strapped to her face !!! (also remember a Dobermanns head is just about crotch hight  )

[ryan1835]

Is no one going to ask how the dog's head is after running into defs rock hard shin? poor little dog

[Taxi Dad]

Is no one going to ask how the dog's head is after running into defs rock hard shin? poor little dog

[Grant Lamontagne]

Any of you that don't like pitbulls really need to go to your local shelter and put your money where your mouths are. Spend some time with strange dogs, especially pitbulls then come on back and let us know how dangerous they are.

I encounter a lot of dogs on a regular basis, many of which are one of the many pitbull type breeds and I'll tell you they are a lot less inclined to be aggressive than other breeds.  Many are dogs I've never met before.  Until you've put the time in with dogs that I have I consider your opinions to be very much flawed.

Cesar Millan uses pitbulls to help teach other dogs to calm down because they are so even tempered.

That's all I'm saying on the subject.

Def

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[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

I like pitbulls but the really are solid lumps aren't they

[AimlessWanderer]

My Grandfather had a pitbull cross when I was a kid. It was the best ever family dog, and absolutely fantastic around everyone - especially kids - until he got old! He was always a bugger with other dogs though, and got into quite a few scraps, even with other bull terriers. He always came out on top irrespective of the dog in question. Around the house he was utterly lovable, out in the park and off the lead was a different kettle of fish altogether though, and my Grandad knew how to handle dogs!. He became a lot less tolerant of people and kids as he go older though, and even I became wary of him after a while (the dog that is, not my Grandad  )

I'm with Heinz, and I am wary of all dogs I don't know irrespective of their owners opinions. Once I've got to know them and made my own mind up I'll accept that individual dog as being "safe", but will not translate that to other dogs of the same breed. Can't accuse me of being stereotypical in that respect  Even when I know a dog is "safe", it's still in the back of my mind that the dog can still turn. I've heard too many tales of lovely family dogs going ape and causing severe harm

My uncle is another who handles dogs very well, and he too had a pitbull which started life as being a lovable family dog and he got it as a pup so he could "mould" it to being everything it needed to be as a family dog. It developed some rather concerning personality traits and my Uncle decided it just wasn't stable enough and had to let it go. The next one he got has been absolutely fine ... so far

I'm sorry, but I'll never accept any comments of this breed is like this, and that breed is like that - yes they may have genetic dispositions in a certain direction, but dog's are just as individual and as prone to going off the rails as we are - but they bite harder and have less morals and restraint when they go nuts

I have no pets and I'm very happy with that!

[jerseydevil]

I had a pit for a number of years, rescued from a shelter when she was a puppy.  She was one of the most pleasant dogs you'd ever come across.  Upon meeting you my little girl would be very timid (she was abused as a pup), but once comfortable with you would be all over you.  She'd jump in your lap, lick your face, and promptly fall asleep.  I feel your pain Def, because "little" girl wasn't too accurate of a description, just what I called her.  She grew to around 70lbs...    When a dog that size is convinced she's a lap dog around the size of a shih tzu and takes a bounding leap into your lap/groin area and puts a paw wrong.....    Sadly she got Lyme Disease, and we eventually had to put her down, it was heartbreaking watching her stagger in a fog on the meds.    My next dog was an Akita/collie mix.  Akitas also have a rep for being aggressive, but he was a big, loving, honestly a bit stupid ball of fuzz.    Throw a tennis ball against a wall, the ball would bounce off, followed quickly by the dog.  Had to do a fair bit of drywall repair when we owned him.... 

[Taxi Dad]

I'm sorry, but I'll never accept any comments of this breed is like this, and that breed is like that - yes they may have genetic dispositions in a certain direction, but dog's are just as individual and as prone to going off the rails as we are - but they bite harder and have less morals and restraint when they go nuts

I agree with this statement, you must never treat dogs just on 'breed specifics', and clearly the bigger and stronger the dog the worse things go wrong when it all hits the fan.

but getting back to the lighter side of this thread, i'm sure it wasn't meant to be to heavy.
Dobbies are always portrayed as 'intelligent' don't believe it ! both of mine , although loveable, were as stupid as a bag of very stupid things !!!

[82brutus]

Think of this as one of those finger slicing incidents when you have a new knife, now that the pit gave you the love tap, you own it... Or maybe it owns you? 



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[AHB]

On one of my running routes, there's a house which have a 15x15 metalfence around the garden and every time i run past it, two of those muscledogs (pitbulls?) comes charging from the backside of the house. They act very aggressive and I don't wanna know what would happen if the gate was open one day.. In Denmark Pitbulls are rarely owned by "ordinary" people as family pets, but often by more "shady" individuals using them as somekind of ego boost.
So yes I guess I'm narrowminded in this matter, but I just don't trust these kind of dogs..

[jzmtl]

On one of my running routes, there's a house which have a 15x15 metalfence around the garden and every time i run past it, two of those muscledogs (pitbulls?) comes charging from the backside of the house. They act very aggressive and I don't wanna know what would happen if the gate was open one day.. In Denmark Pitbulls are rarely owned by "ordinary" people as family pets, but often by more "shady" individuals using them as somekind of ego boost.
So yes I guess I'm narrowminded in this matter, but I just don't trust these kind of dogs..

I keep a large folder clipped IWB when I run (Spyderco pacific salt specifically), probably won't make much of a difference if two of those come at me, but still better than bare knuckle.

[Gareth]

Pitbulls should all be made to have poodle-perms?  Might soften the blow some.

Hope the leg's OK Boss.

[AimlessWanderer]

Pitbulls should all be made to have poodle-perms?  Might soften the blow some.

Hope the leg's OK Boss.

Not sure of Ruby Doggy's exact pedigree, but can't see Chrissy going for that plan somehow 

Besides, I think I'd feel even worse if I just had my thigh muscle torn from the bone and the offending creature had an 80's perm 

[Gareth]

Pitbulls should all be made to have poodle-perms?  Might soften the blow some.

Hope the leg's OK Boss.

Not sure of Ruby Doggy's exact pedigree, but can't see Chrissy going for that plan somehow 

Besides, I think I'd feel even worse if I just had my thigh muscle torn from the bone and the offending creature had an 80's perm

best not hang around any Mancunian footballers then.