conceal carry

[firefightingjosh]

looking at a new CCP. So many choices and calibers, but thinking .380 or 9mm(although a compact 45ACP too). so far I like the following

Ruger LC9 and LCP
Taurus(yea some say yuck..) PT 709 and TCP
Glock 42
Springfield XDS in the 9mm or even the 45acp..
KAHR pm9 or PM380

 Any others for say under 500 bucks?

I generally do carry daily and wear wranglers and am a smaller framed person so a small framed gun is nice.
Thinking 380 is too small for self defense, since im actually more worried about animals out here in montana than I am people. I have several home defense guns, and currantly carry my taurus slim 9mm pt709... I own  everything from kimber pistols to tikka rifles, to a hi point pistol and  a decent shooting rem 700.. Im more about practicality and what works than what the name is on the side.

Josh

[Grant Lamontagne]

I don't have a CCW, since in Canada they aren't available, but I'd always thought that if I did I'd probably go with some variety of semi automatic .22.  The ammo is cheap and with the low recoil you can put three well placed shots on target very quickly.  Lots of people respond to that with "a .22 doesn't have any stopping power" and maybe they are right, but I have never heard of anyone getting hit and yelling "I'm ok, it was only a .22!"

Of course that might not apply too much to animals though- what animals specifically are you concerned about?  A .22 will pretty well take care of anything dog sized or less, but if you are worried about things like bears then I'd go with something MUCH bigger.  Bears are really easy to hit as they are fairly slow moving and very large.  Make sure you hit them good though, anything less will probably just annoy them.  For coyotes or mountain lions I'd want something in the 9mm range as you want something relatively light but with more power than a .22 since they are very likely to be moving and require multiple rounds. 

I'm also partial to revolvers.  I realize modern semis rarely jam, but I still prefer the simplicity of knowing that every time I squeeze the trigger, something is coming out the end.  When you are in a situation where you are surrounded by animals who mean to do you harm you just can't take the chance that it won't fire.

Def

[lister]

I have nothing to say about weapons, but I do have a comment about the speed of bears. Have you ever seen a footage of a bear running? They are quite fast, agile and not that easy to kill! 

[powernoodle]

I'm no expert, but it's hard for me to imagine any concealed carry pistol slowing down a bear, elk, etc.

I've carried legally for 20+ years.  For the past 10, I've been doing pocket carry only.  There are certainly sacrifices that have to be made no matter what you carry or how you carry, but for me the convenience of pocket carry outweighs everything else.  I rotate through a S&W 442, Ruger LCP, Kel-tec PF9, Kahr PM9, and S&W Shield 9mm.  The Shield is a little big for pocket carry, but the rest are easy (in an Uncle Mike's pocket holster of the correct size).  My primary carry is the 442, as it is smooth like a bar of soap in the pocket, but still launches 5 rounds of spice .38 +P.  Rock on.

[dks]

If you are fighting bears then I doubt you will need to hide your weapon. 

A shotgun might work better, from close by.

[firefightingjosh]

Ha, I carry a 44 mag for a bear gun, but just as a daily gun its a bit big. I mostly want a pocket gun that will put a stop to people, dogs..etc.

[Grant Lamontagne]

I have nothing to say about weapons, but I do have a comment about the speed of bears. Have you ever seen a footage of a bear running? They are quite fast, agile and not that easy to kill!

Footage?  I have seen bears run- in person. 

They are fast but require some time to get up to speed and only last for short distances.  From a dead stop they are unable to pounce on someone like a mountain lion or lynx, nor are they going to sneak up on you as they are rather large and not overly stealthy.  Basically if a bear is running then you will have ample notice that they are there. 

Against people and dogs I would go back to a .22.  Sure it may not stop a large, powerful dog intent on ripping into you, but these same dogs have been known to shrug off multiple .44 rounds as well.  Better to have an accurate small round that you can get multiple rounds off faster than one larger calibre round that may or may not hit the target.

Personally though I think if you really want to be protected against a dog attack, this is a much more effective weapon to carry:



I know very few dogs that aren't terrified of these!

Def

[mtngoat]

I have a Taurus TCP I carry everyday, love it, it is a tad small but you can get mag extensions for.  As far as the product itself, i had to send it back to Taurus for misfeed issues, they come with a lifetime warranty and the TCP and 709 are assembled if FL so the turn around was weeks.  Now that its back I have put several hundreds of rounds through it of ball and various hollow point with no issue.

I was going to get a 709 but they were out when I went get it so I got the 809, haven't had a single issue with it in over a yr and close to 700 rounds.

If I was to go out today and get something today it would be the XDS though, it shoots good, conceals well and in 9mm or 45acp. I would still carry the TCP as backup

[ducttapetech]

I have nothing to say about weapons, but I do have a comment about the speed of bears. Have you ever seen a footage of a bear running? They are quite fast, agile and not that easy to kill!

Footage?  I have seen bears run- in person. 

They are fast but require some time to get up to speed and only last for short distances.  From a dead stop they are unable to pounce on someone like a mountain lion or lynx, nor are they going to sneak up on you as they are rather large and not overly stealthy.  Basically if a bear is running then you will have ample notice that they are there. 

Against people and dogs I would go back to a .22.  Sure it may not stop a large, powerful dog intent on ripping into you, but these same dogs have been known to shrug off multiple .44 rounds as well.  Better to have an accurate small round that you can get multiple rounds off faster than one larger calibre round that may or may not hit the target.

Personally though I think if you really want to be protected against a dog attack, this is a much more effective weapon to carry:

(Image removed from quote.)

I know very few dogs that aren't terrified of these!

Def

Or a bar of soap and a water hose.

that's us mobile

[Grant Lamontagne]

Come to think of it, I'd probably keep my distance from a guy walking around with a dustbuster holstered on his hip- or worse, IWB..... 

Def

[NutSAK]

I carry either a Glock 26 in IWB holster or a S&W 442 Airweight in IWB holster or pocket holster, depending on what I'm wearing.  The S&W is much easier for me to conceal, but is much more difficult to shoot accurately without a good deal of training.

I highly recommend the 26 if you can carry it comfortably.  In operation, it feels very natural to me, and is extremely reliable.  It's not too hard to find one in good used condition for under $500.

There's no way in hell I would carry .22.  If you can't get off multiple rounds of .380, .38 or 9mm quickly and accurately, you simply aren't training enough and probably shouldn't be carrying.  If you decide you're going to carry 9mm, be sure to find the right defense ammo for your weapon--one that doesn't over-penetrate.

[nate j]

My S&W 360PD is my favorite pocket gun.  It is very light, and of course gives the option of using .357 mag, .38 + P or .38 Special.  Besides the fairly stout recoil of full power .357 magnum rounds out of a gun that weighs less than 12 oz empty, the only other negative might be the price.  I think they are going for about $800 new, but perhaps you could find a used one for $500.

[Chako]

<--- has been chased by black bears on 3 separate occasions.

My most memorable one was camping at Blueberry hill campground back in 1981, 3 of us where on bikes and we almost ran over a cub. Mother rushed us. We just had time to do a 90 and hightail it out of there. These were one speed bikes by the way. She chases us right through the park up to the highway. On the left side is what we called the one mile hill. We figured she would catch the slowest of us for sure if we headed that way, so we all hung a right. She did stop chasing us at the highway though...but it was quite some time before one of us got the courage to look back. That was probably the scariest time of my life.

The other two incidents were less adrenalin inducing but equally frightening to some extend. Not fun when black bears start to stalk/hunt you in the forest. The one time, I was with a bunch of classmates on a field trip in University. The second time, I was at the outdoor archery range. That time I had my bow but only field-points.

[derekmac]

<--- has been chased by black bears on 3 separate occasions.

My most memorable one was camping at Blueberry hill campground back in 1981, 3 of us where on bikes and we almost ran over a cub. Mother rushed us. We just had time to do a 90 and hightail it out of there. These were one speed bikes by the way. She chases us right through the park up to the highway. On the left side is what we called the one mile hill. We figured she would catch the slowest of us for sure if we headed that way, so we all hung a right. She did stop chasing us at the highway though...but it was quite some time before one of us got the courage to look back. That was probably the scariest time of my life.

The other two incidents were less adrenalin inducing but equally frightening to some extend. Not fun when black bears start to stalk/hunt you in the forest. The one time, I was with a bunch of classmates on a field trip in University. The second time, I was at the outdoor archery range. That time I had my bow but only field-points.

Note to all.  Do NOT go into the woods with Dan!!!   

Glad you didn't end up as a bear treat though!   

[Chako]

You only have to outrun the slowest. 

Seriously though, the only thing that puts a little fear in me around here are black bears. Darn things are smart and dangerous.

[stealth007s]

I have carried both the Springfield XD .40 sub-compact and Ruger LCP .380. I find the .380 the easiest for me to carry as I pocket carry that gun. Anything carried on the waist you need to make sure you dress properly so it will remain concealed. My .40 that I waist carry is in a Crossbreed holster.

[Grail Knight]

I have had a concealed carry permit going on 30 years and carry either a 9mm or 9x18 Makarov
I do have a backup pistol I carry (NAA PUG .22mag) but it is a last resort firearm.

Normally I carry my Sig Sauer ISWB.

[Lynn LeFey]

I've tested a lot of pistols for concealed carry, and of them, I've preferred the Springfield XD the most, then the S&W M&P Compact. However, as I've never carried, you have to understand that this is strictly from a shooting perspective. My husband preferred the S&W Shield.

It is an unsolvable dilemma as to which caliber to carry, because each person comes at it with different criteria. I tend to look at it (from an urban perspective) like this; no one wants holes in them, regardless of size. So while I'd shy away from .22, pretty much anything else is fair game. Since .32, and .380 ammo is more expensive than 9mm, 9 tends to be my next stopping point. It's a round that is largely considered 'acceptable' for self defense, but remains small enough for reasonable capacity in a concealed carry pistol. I also find the recoil from the 9mm quiet tolerable in the small and light pistols designed for CC. I'm not happy with .40s and .45s I've fired in small frame pistols. Too snappy.

Strangely, because of the shape of the .22 (flared rim), there really aren't .22 pistols out there that would work for CC that have more than a 10 shot capacity. Whereas, the S&W M&P Compact has a 12+1 capacity. If the thickness of a double-stack mag is an issue in making the firearm comfortable to conceal, though, then most 9's start looking at about 7 round cap.

However, all this is built around my consideration of needing the firearm due to human threat. You may think straight-up stopping power is more important, if bears are your primary concern.

[Aloha]

<--- has been chased by black bears on 3 separate occasions.

My most memorable one was camping at Blueberry hill campground back in 1981, 3 of us where on bikes and we almost ran over a cub. Mother rushed us. We just had time to do a 90 and hightail it out of there. These were one speed bikes by the way. She chases us right through the park up to the highway. On the left side is what we called the one mile hill. We figured she would catch the slowest of us for sure if we headed that way, so we all hung a right. She did stop chasing us at the highway though...but it was quite some time before one of us got the courage to look back. That was probably the scariest time of my life.

The other two incidents were less adrenalin inducing but equally frightening to some extend. Not fun when black bears start to stalk/hunt you in the forest. The one time, I was with a bunch of classmates on a field trip in University. The second time, I was at the outdoor archery range. That time I had my bow but only field-points.

Note to all.  Do NOT go into the woods with Dan!!!   

Glad you didn't end up as a bear treat though!   

That just scared the heck outta me as I read this.

[Mr. Whippy]

For Bears:



It may take a couple rounds, but it'll stop a bear.  That's why it's called a Ruger Alaskan

[NutSAK]

It may take a couple rounds, but it'll stop a bear.  That's why it's called a Ruger Alaskan

.454?

[Mr. Whippy]

It may take a couple rounds, but it'll stop a bear.  That's why it's called a Ruger Alaskan

.454?

Yup.

[captain spaulding]

It may take a couple rounds, but it'll stop a bear.  That's why it's called a Ruger Alaskan

.454?

Yup.

 


Ammo must be a smurf to find. It would be around here at least. Unless you load your own.

[jerseydevil]

It may take a couple rounds, but it'll stop a bear.  That's why it's called a Ruger Alaskan

.454?

Yup.

 


Ammo must be a smurf to find. It would be around here at least. Unless you load your own.

Full power ammo might be a bit hard to find off the shelf, but a .454 Casull will also chamber and fire .45 Colt.  Very nice revolver mr. Whippy. 

[captain spaulding]

It may take a couple rounds, but it'll stop a bear.  That's why it's called a Ruger Alaskan

.454?

Yup.

 


Ammo must be a smurf to find. It would be around here at least. Unless you load your own.

Full power ammo might be a bit hard to find off the shelf, but a .454 Casull will also chamber and fire .45 Colt.  Very nice revolver mr. Whippy. 

Oh I know. Who do you think your talking to here?   

[jerseydevil]

It may take a couple rounds, but it'll stop a bear.  That's why it's called a Ruger Alaskan

.454?

Yup.

 


Ammo must be a smurf to find. It would be around here at least. Unless you load your own.

Full power ammo might be a bit hard to find off the shelf, but a .454 Casull will also chamber and fire .45 Colt.  Very nice revolver mr. Whippy. 

Oh I know. Who do you think your talking to here?   

   Sorry!  Just making sure.  Once I had to explain to a member here how and why the correct ammo for their Ruger LCP .380 was actually the stuff marked .380 ACP.  They were getting a bit fustrated that they couldn't find any LCP marked boxes....   

[captain spaulding]

No comment! 



Seriously though, thats how people learn. My opinion is they should know something of that importance before the purchase, but you where there to help so i'm assuming all is well now. 

[nate j]

I do have a backup pistol I carry (NAA PUG .22mag) but it is a last resort firearm.

How do you like it?  I looked at those, but just couldn't bring myself to take a .22 (even a .22 mag) seriously as defensive firearm.

[captain spaulding]

I wouldn't suggest any .22 thats rimfire for self defense with a few exceptions. First is if it is all you have and have no other choice but to us it as your primary defensive gun. Second would be if it is a revolver. My reasoning behind this is inherently rimfire ammunition is more likely to experience a problem with the primer not going off or even ejection issues. Now the reason I would say a .22 revolver is a exception is because if you experience a problem like that (if its double-action) you can just pull the trigger again or (single-action) cock the hammer and pull the trigger. The round will not cause a jam like it could in a semi automatic making your gun useless in a time of need. The last exception would be as a backup gun. Two is one, and one is none. Just my opinion though.