The month the world woke up?

[Benner]

4X4 are a very contentious issue, at least Ben has a good reason to have one, as where he works, the roads are usually under water , but the other 90% you've got to wonder about, ever tried to find a parking space in town for anthing bigger than Scooter

And yeah, what he said. 

Plus, my car is actually a 2 wheel drive vehicle that has the ability of going 4x4.  It's not just a 4x4.

I also forgot you need a 4x4 to carry the weight of your EDC equipment too, so you do have a reason to be carrying one, sorry Ben

Exactly!! 

Apology accepted. 

 

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Thread derailed by Darren

[NutSAK]

You know fuel prices affects you "green" guys as well.  Fuel is needed to drive the trucks that deliver the goods that we all need, if fuel goes up, so do costs and so does the price of that product you want.

Not only transportation costs, but what about all of the products and packaging you buy that is made from petroleum?

[Tarrodemierda]

"OK I'll give Ben a break this time.The one's I was referring to really are the people who have these huge X5's and Lexus 4x4's etc who do nothing more than carry their little girl to school 1mile down the road and take up two spaces instead of the normal one. Just pointless really. I'm glad I have a smaller caller, I can nip through smallish gaps, park easier, and get more MPG"

my thoughts too.

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

You know fuel prices affects you "green" guys as well.  Fuel is needed to drive the trucks that deliver the goods that we all need, if fuel goes up, so do costs and so does the price of that product you want.

Not only transportation costs, but what about all of the products and packaging you buy that is made from petroleum?

All true, which just go's to show that we all need to wake up to this looming disaster.

[cryptrick]

Thread derailed by Darren

Sorry, it's what I'm good at!

[Tarrodemierda]

You know fuel prices affects you "green" guys as well.  Fuel is needed to drive the trucks that deliver the goods that we all need, if fuel goes up, so do costs and so does the price of that product you want.

Not only transportation costs, but what about all of the products and packaging you buy that is made from petroleum?

i think here in finland atleast they should really hard to learn to pack more economically.i leave always at shop all that packing  i can get rid off.its stupid to pack things in large blister packs when some recycled paperbox would do the same,and usually in blister i still find some paperbox,an some thingy in in,it vacuum or other plastic bag or paper wrap.

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Thread derailed by Darren

Sorry, it's what I'm good at!

Pesky Brit's good for nothing but thread derailment

[cryptrick]

I've been looking for this vid for the last 15mins and found it. Its a good way to get the message across, don't ya think!

[NutSAK]

You know fuel prices affects you "green" guys as well.  Fuel is needed to drive the trucks that deliver the goods that we all need, if fuel goes up, so do costs and so does the price of that product you want.

Not only transportation costs, but what about all of the products and packaging you buy that is made from petroleum?

All true, which just go's to show that we all need to wake up to this looming disaster.

I couldn't agree with you more.  My broken ankle got me cycling to work, and soon I'm probably going to be selling off my Broncos.  If I get what I want from them, I will be buying a small motorcycle also.

This is a real change for me, as I've been a Bronco fanatic my whole life. 

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

You know fuel prices affects you "green" guys as well.  Fuel is needed to drive the trucks that deliver the goods that we all need, if fuel goes up, so do costs and so does the price of that product you want.

Not only transportation costs, but what about all of the products and packaging you buy that is made from petroleum?

i think here in finland atleast they should really hard to learn to pack more economically.i leave always at shop all that packing  i can get rid off.its stupid to pack things in large blister packs when some recycled paperbox would do the same,and usually in blister i still find some paperbox,an some thingy in in,it vacuum or other plastic bag or paper wrap.

Biodegradable packaging is mandatory in Switzerland, and over here most thing's are now recyclable

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

You know fuel prices affects you "green" guys as well.  Fuel is needed to drive the trucks that deliver the goods that we all need, if fuel goes up, so do costs and so does the price of that product you want.

Not only transportation costs, but what about all of the products and packaging you buy that is made from petroleum?

All true, which just go's to show that we all need to wake up to this looming disaster.

I couldn't agree with you more.  My broken ankle got me cycling to work, and soon I'm probably going to be selling off my Broncos.  If I get what I want from them, I will be buying a small motorcycle also.

This is a real change for me, as I've been a Bronco fanatic my whole life. 

Wow that is a big step, you've had them in the blood for a good long while now ,

Good on you though mate , I hated going from 900cc to a 250cc, but you do get used to it, and sailing past a huge line of hot sweaty motorists in there cars, and going to the front of the traffic never ever get's old

[NutSAK]

I'm sure I will regret it (deeply) at times, but I do still have the Jeep XJ (Cherokee) when I need it.

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

I've been looking for this vid for the last 15mins and found it. Its a good way to get the message across, don't ya think!

It would be great to be a part of something like that, but be prepared to be arrested for it over here (traffic violation's being the 'new' murder over here )

[Tarrodemierda]

is it?mandatory even?
cool!

just like the multitool combo i purchased,that lm als with folder knife.its packed in some 30 x 40 cm blister that wont fit anywhere(hey now i need an car to drag that bugger packing home).stoopid as a man can get.id rather buy just that aluminium case filled with tools,in paperbox,nothing else.hck,id buy it even without any box,cause i wont be dragging that case into woods ever.

i bet even reatil prices could be lower if they get rid of those oversize packs,and more actual stuff can be transported in one truckload thatways.so in my maths that would make transporting cheaper.

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

I'm sure I will regret it (deeply) at times, but I do still have the Jeep XJ (Cherokee) when I need it.

So what bike/size are you after mate

[cryptrick]

I've been looking for this vid for the last 15mins and found it. Its a good way to get the message across, don't ya think!

It would be great to be a part of something like that, but be prepared to be arrested for it over here (traffic violation's being the 'new' murder over here )

True, unfortunately

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

is it?mandatory even?
cool!

just like the multitool combo i purchased,that lm als with folder knife.its packed in some 30 x 40 cm blister that wont fit anywhere(hey now i need an car to drag that bugger packing home).stoopid as a man can get.id rather buy just that aluminium case filled with tools,in paperbox,nothing else.hck,id buy it even without any box,cause i wont be dragging that case into woods ever.

i bet even reatil prices could be lower if they get rid of those oversize packs,and more actual stuff can be transported in one truckload thatways.so in my maths that would make transporting cheaper.

Bulk shipping would workout a lot cheaper, but until the logistical companies get there head around it, it probably won't happen

[Tarrodemierda]

u get used to gettin arrested for being concerned about enviroment and yuppie politics ,trust me u get used to that.

 

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

u get used to gettin arrested for being concerned about enviroment and yuppie politics ,trust me u get used to that.

 

I'm sure there's a story there mate

[Tarrodemierda]

yep there is,and ive noticed heres some law enforcment dudes so i must keep mu trap shut 

nooh...

ive been in all kindsa anti this,anti that happenings,that are looked over,badly by those who operate the system the way they see its best...for their wallets at least.

lets say ie,i wont ever accept any celebration of independency that involwes gettin drunk by tax payers money,and celebrities and drug junkies,nasty politicicans and people who care just for their own happiness,celebrating in presidents castle while homeless and unemployed ones are gettin cold and fed up,and they dont even invite war veterans who really made us free,into their party.that sucks a lot to me.

and that youth dont have places to have some d-i-y lessons,handcrafts shops,places to have band reherseals,to have open speeches,but the one s in power have still money to build up some awful looking and really expensive operahouses that arent open for normal tax payin public

u have to fight against the system.

Fight forever and never give up.


and in that fight u get beat up and arrested 

 

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Well at least you're willing to stand up and be counted mate , there's plenty that won't

Liberty and justice are worth a few scars

[Grant Lamontagne]

I realize that I'm part of the problem... I own two vehicles, a Pontiac Sunfire and an evil 4x4. 

They say a man who is good for an excuse is good for little else, so here are my reasons for having two cars, one of which has relatively bad fuel economy.

1.  The buses in my area are horrible.  It would take about an hour and fifteen minutes (no exaggeration) to get to the local mall, a place I could walk to in 20-25 minutes, even with my bad foot.  The reason for that is that the best bus services come by every half hour, and I'd have to change buses at least once.

2.  The buses don't go to all the places I work, and I often work out of the city, sometimes in neighboring cities. 

3.  If I didn't have a car, I'd have no where to sit at some of my jobs, and I'd have a huge bloody backpack to carry the equipment I use in some places.

4.  My other job finishes at a time when the buses are long since finished, and the only option is either a taxi (almost impossible to get at that time of the morning, and is burning gas anyway) or having a co worker drive out of their way to drop me off.

5.  Some of the places I work are pretty challenging terrain, where if I managed to get my car in, I'd never get it back out.  Littering a perfectly good car in the woods or hiring a tow truck to pull me out again would probably have even greater environmental impact!

6.  I'm a lazy sod, and my foot/knee issues make it very difficult to cycle, which is why I have a kayak now.

Def

[Grant Lamontagne]

That having been said, I am all for conservation and try to make as few trips as possible, minimizing the fuel expended.  That has little to do with rising fuel costs, and just as little to do with air pollution- I'm a cheap bugger, and the cost of every minute I am driving eats away at me, especially if it's a drive I don't have to make.

Conservation isn't just an ecological thing- it makes financial sense as well.  No one stands to gain anything by killing the planet, or chopping down the rain forests to the point where none of us can breathe.  However, you won't see the end of cars tomorrow- they are too important to our society.  What we need to do is not do away with cars, we need to find a better, more efficient way to run them, and on a better, non polluting, renewable fuel system.  Hydrogen fuel cells are a reality, but deemed unsafe due to explosion hazards, and the same can be said for alcohol based systems.  It's not because they are inherently unsafe (gasoline explodes too, remember the Pinto?) but because the oil companies are discrediting them.  You want to see the world turn greener?  Invest any money or expertise you have in furthering the research being done into alternative fuels, or help promote the existing discoveries if you don't have any money or expertise. 

If someone could come up with a reliable, inexpensive option to run my Jeep with the same kind of power (or at least similar) I am getting now, and an inexpensive enough conversion to make it worthwhile, I wouldn't hesitate to make the switch, and I'm certain most folks would switch as well.

Def

[Tarrodemierda]

Hats up 4 u defender,i must say u have a point and understanding too for this hellish wheel called life on this planet.

its an vicious circle.

 

[Poncho65]

I don't even know where to start on that one. 

Start by cycling to work you lazy sod

I live 90 miles from where I work 1 way  Don't believe I could hack a bike ride that far everyday  But there are 4 of us who carpool 

[Grant Lamontagne]

It's interesting that this has come up now... I have been looking at a home biodiesel kit and wondering how feasible it really is.  At the moment, I am in an apartment, so it's not an option, but my wife and I are looking at houses, most of which have oil burning furnaces, which is the most common way of heating homes here.  Beside the cost of the equipment (starting around $3,500) the cost of the finished fuel is around $1.35US/gallon, compared to something like $4/gallon for regular diesel.  Plus, it offers significantly less contaminants, and if I've been researching the right sites, roughly 50 gallons can be cranked out in about 2 days.  If that's the case, I'd seriously consider doing it, disconnecting from the power grid and running my own generator.

Anyone know anything about biodiesel kits?  Is it really that easy to make your own?  The numbers I've seen have made me seriously consider a diesel conversion for my Jeep.

Def

[Tarrodemierda]

hmm i havent seen any,but hey live here in peripheria behind god.
i beleive its not the most easiest way,to modify an gas engine into diesel cause diesel demends lots of compression to burn,all the timings are different,u have to almost chenge the whole head,cause diesels tend to use more like jets that push the pre compressed/heated(?) gas mixture into combustion chamber....im not sure.

do u guys there heat your houses with wood pellets?


i wonder how they make those bio-fuels.i saw one national geographic film of makin those,and it starves all other plants around those commercial"bio fule" fields....and they hack s--tloads of rainforests to make bigger plantations,and thats wrong to wild life,unacceptable to kill monkeys etc too by pushing them to more tinier living spaces.

all this in mind,i wont make i kid here 

[Grant Lamontagne]

There's a site that sells home biodiesel kits.  Here's some videos on biodiesel:

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcKpIB1HYKM]Biodeisel Man, Part 1

Biodiesel Man, Part 2

Biodiesel for Beginners

A Quick Lesson in Making Biodiesel

Wood pellets are also in use here, as are regular wood burning stoves, and electric heat.

Def

[WhichDawg]

interesting thread, I've been thinking about this for awhile now;
"how can I make it better? and how will things/I change?"

back in Chicago (where my family is) every summer we used to go camping in Michigan,
Memorial day, the 4th of July, and Labor day, it was a 2-3 hour drive. After this past Memorial day
I called my family to find out how it went (I'm too far now to go) and they said it was the
strangest trip ever!

the roads were empty, going and coming. When I used to go, congestion was a pain,
the traffic could be such a nightmare, especially coming home, but not this time.
They said it was like ghost roads, people stayed home, I was shocked and still am.

I wonder how long it will last, how long will it take for people to adjust and then go back to their old
bad habits? So many people in this country think it's just big business driving prices up, to make bigger profits
(especially political parties).

I truly hope alternative solutions are finally taken (solar, electric, bio, etc)
and people/the world "ME" change our lifestyle and stop wasting and taking things for granted.