Any mechanics here?

tosh · **on:** May 31, 2015, 08:15:39 PM

We bought another car last weekend. Nothing flash just a little old Suzuki Wagon R 1.3L

Everything seems fine, considering it's 13yrs old.
I cycle to work but lack of transport is forcing ever more pressure on my partner as she then has to do all the little errands that we all take for granted when you're used to having personal transport.

Anyway before we start spending money on servicing costs we'd like to run it for a few weeks to make sure there's nothing seriously wrong with it. At the moment its drives and sounds lovely.

I've just been out to check the oil level and it looks a little low.Obviously I've no idea what's in it (synthetic or semisynthetic) nor do I know what viscosity it is.
But I'd just like to top it up to ensure everything's OK for the next couple of weeks - then we'll see about servicing it.

Can I just top it up with anything?? ( in the garage I've got half a litre of lawnmower oil 30sae and 10 -40 diesel engine oil) I know I shouldn't, but it's sunday evening, everywhere is shut except for the local filling station and we're both back at work tomorrow and to make matters worse tomorrow is the first time in several months of cycling to work where I've got to go someplace straight from work, so I'lI need to use the car.

I really can't see the car doing more than a couple of hundred miles between now and the end of the month. As I say It'll hardly get used, which explains why we wanted something small, cheap and hopefully reliable.

Any advice would be greatly welcome.

Thanks

zimchaz · **Reply #1 on:** May 31, 2015, 09:06:08 PM

Any oil is better than no oil...BUT...I wouldn't advise adding a random oil if the level is still between the upper and lower limits (although a little low).
You could lower or raise the viscosity to the point where permanent damage is caused.

Smashie · **Reply #2 on:** May 31, 2015, 09:11:50 PM

Go to Halfords website and enter the details for your car and it will tell you what oil it needs

tosh · **Reply #3 on:** May 31, 2015, 09:28:02 PM

OK, just been onto Halfords website......

3 recommendations:-

10x40 part synthetic
10x40
5x30

I don't want to put the wrong stuff in, nor do I want to drain and refill without replacing the oil filter!

What would the garage do if someone just pulled up and asked for a top up?

It must happen all the time, how do they know what's already in??

Would it be safe to add half a litre of 10w40?? (What's the difference between oil designed for diesel engines and petrol engines?

Smashie · **Reply #4 on:** May 31, 2015, 09:35:46 PM

Does it say in the owners manual?

tosh · **Reply #5 on:** May 31, 2015, 09:46:47 PM

It gives a wide choice in the owners manual
20w-50
15w-40 15w-50
10w-40 10w-50
10w- 30. "Preferred" it says
5w-30

Then states be sure to use oil under quality classification
SE, SF, SG, SH, SJ and SL
I've no idea what any of that means

Smashie · **Reply #6 on:** May 31, 2015, 10:02:34 PM

Hmm tricky, I would go for the preferred option and then do an oil and filer change

tosh · **Reply #7 on:** May 31, 2015, 10:20:55 PM

The filling station is nearby

Shall I go and grab a litre of 10w-30 semi synthetic

Just wondered if that would cover in case its got either mineral, synthetic or semi synthetic already in.

Typically Sunday

Smashie · **Reply #8 on:** May 31, 2015, 10:23:56 PM

If it's not bellow the minimum mark on the dipstick then I wouldn't panic. If it is then top it up with anything and then change the oil and filter at the weekend

lowtech · **Reply #9 on:** May 31, 2015, 10:50:30 PM

Quote from: tosh on May 31, 2015, 09:28:02 PM

OK, just been onto Halfords website......

3 recommendations:-

10x40 part synthetic
10x40
5x30

I don't want to put the wrong stuff in, nor do I want to drain and refill without replacing the oil filter!

What would the garage do if someone just pulled up and asked for a top up?

It must happen all the time, how do they know what's already in??

Would it be safe to add half a litre of 10w40?? (What's the difference between oil designed for diesel engines and petrol engines?

10W40 part syntethic is a good choice for regular use.
10W40 synth is the better variant if you often do short drives (many cold starts)
5W30 synth is usually the choice for elongated service intervals

I´d say, don´t top off until above Min., if you do, use one of the aforementioned. Worst that can happe is that the oil will be "downgraded" to the least quality in the mix, which still is in spec for your car. All of todays engine oils can be mixed with each other (Rizinus based oils aside), the only negative effect is that all the oil will tend to behaved like the cheapest/least additivated.

Diesel/petrol oils have different additives, the Diesel has more additives to keep small particles afloat while the petrol oil has additives to withstand thinning by petrol and alkalic remnants from the burning process.

I can answer longer and more elaborated tomorrow, but need to hop under the shower and into my bed now.

tosh · **Reply #10 on:** May 31, 2015, 11:42:40 PM

Thanks to everyone for their advice.
I did finally drive to the filling station and purchased a litre of 10W-40 Castrol GTX semi synthetic
I couldn't believe it when it consumed almost the entire bottle to bring the level between min & max on the dipstick.
I'm concerned the level was so low. It had been stood for almost 3 months prior to us purchasing it and going by the MOT certificate has done less than 300 miles since last November.
I did check under the engine for oil leaks and was pretty taken aback that there was absolutely no sign of any oil anywhere!! Coolant level seems correct, it doesn't smoke, pulls really well for such an old small car and just drives sweet.

So, why the low oil level?? Alarm bells are ringing!!

gregozedobe · **Reply #11 on:** June 01, 2015, 03:20:55 AM

Quote from: tosh on May 31, 2015, 11:42:40 PM

So, why the low oil level?? Alarm bells are ringing!!

It might not have been filled up past the minimum last time oil was added.

I wouldn't start panicking just yet. Just monitor the oil level for a while to see what is happening.

One thing to remember is if a vehicle is mainly driven on short trips where the engine doesn't get properly warmed up for an extended time, then water can condense in the oil, raising the level shown on the dipstick. If you then go for longer drive at highway speeds these condensates can get boiled off and the oil level can suddenly drop.

captain spaulding · **Reply #12 on:** June 01, 2015, 04:01:56 AM

Quote from: gregozedobe on June 01, 2015, 03:20:55 AM

Quote from: tosh on May 31, 2015, 11:42:40 PM
So, why the low oil level?? Alarm bells are ringing!!
It might not have been filled up past the minimum last time oil was added.

I wouldn't start panicking just yet. Just monitor the oil level for a while to see what is happening.

One thing to remember is if a vehicle is mainly driven on short trips where the engine doesn't get properly warmed up for an extended time, then water can condense in the oil, raising the level shown on the dipstick. If you then go for longer drive at highway speeds these condensates can get boiled off and the oil level can suddenly drop.

Don't worry to much if you are not noticing any signs of damage. Keep a close eye on the oil level. I would just do a proper oil change (and filter) and keep monitoring regularly to see exactly what is going on. When you do the first oil change you will need to decide what exact oil you will want to use for the future of the car.

DazMechanical · **Reply #13 on:** June 01, 2015, 05:31:00 AM

I've been I mechanic for 13 yrs. As others have said any oil is better than no oil. 10w40 semi synthetic is a good option which can be used in most vehicles. A complete change with filter would be better than a top up. Then you know it's fresh oil in there and when to change it next time. Changing the coolant wouldn't be a bad idea also if you don't know when it was last done.

Crow · **Reply #14 on:** June 01, 2015, 08:38:23 AM

Dont worry, let the bells be quiet. Every car will consume oil. Be sure to check levels when motor is warm, and stood still for few minutes. Remember to park car with good levell. Same with coolant. There is big volume difference with cold liquids, and warm liquids.

tosh · **Reply #15 on:** June 01, 2015, 11:12:38 AM

I checked again this morning and the oil level was between min&max. Took virtually the shole 1 litre of oil I bought.
The car was on a slope first time I checked yesterday so my initial thought was that was why. So I started it up and reversed it further up my drive to where it levels out. Left it a hour and came back, the oil was at the very tip of the dip stick!!

I'll get both oil filter and air filter plus some good quality oil for this coming weekend.
I shouldn't say this but I didn't think to check the oil when we bought it

the guy was so genuine and the car so clean and pulled away easily on the test drive with 3 adults and my son in.
As I say it's only done 38k since 2002, the mileage seems correct as I cross referenced it online with MOT records.

There was nothing whatsoever to give me cause for concern when we initially viewed it - it is what it is.....an old small car.

Anyway, time will tell as they say.

DazMechanical · **Reply #16 on:** June 01, 2015, 11:42:10 AM

With that kind of mileage you shouldn't have any major issues anytime soon

I don't wanna scare you or anything but be sure to change the oil and filter at least every 10,000km or every 6 months if not using it that much. I only say this as I have had to rebuild 3 low mileage motors in the past few months due to sludge build up from lack of oil changes.

tosh · **Reply #17 on:** June 02, 2015, 07:37:00 PM

More advice needed...

Should I flush first.
I've read that its a very bad idea. I'm beginning to think "Little Suzy" has missed most of her services. So, I plan to try and get her tip top.

My plan was on Friday after work - 11am, go the (very) long way home, drain the oil and refill with cheapest oil I can get then go for another drive, return home, drain that, replace the oil filter and refill with good quality semi synthetic 10w30...Any recommendations?
Also change the air filter too.

Does that sound OK?

Crow · **Reply #18 on:** June 02, 2015, 07:53:22 PM

I would rather change oil and filter now, drive 2-3 thousand km. And then change again. Use same good guality oil. Ther will allways be left some of old oil.

Even better would be to change oil and filter, drive 2-3 thousand, take oil bottom off, wash it and change oil ring and filte, put in new oil. No old oil left in engine.

tosh · **Reply #19 on:** June 02, 2015, 08:03:34 PM

Quote from: Crow on June 02, 2015, 07:53:22 PM

I would rather change oil and filter now, drive 2-3 thousand km. And then change again. Use same good guality oil. Ther will allways be left some of old oil.

Even better would be to change oil and filter, drive 2-3 thousand, take oil bottom off, wash it and change oil ring and filte, put in new oil. No old oil left in engine.

You mean take off sump?
I did consider that, but I can't find a workshop manual for the car. Do you have to replace the sump gasket? And how would I find the torque setting for the sump bolts?

What's an "oil ring"? Is it the copper washer on the sump plug?

Mr. Whippy · **Reply #20 on:** June 02, 2015, 08:07:33 PM

No. The oil filter and seal.

BTW, if you added 10w30 you would be fine. In this modern age, oils are compatible with other oils (synth and dino). Adding 10w30 to 10w40 will not cause a problem. 10w30 to 5w30 will not cause a problem.

The rules are:

Dirty oil is better than no oil
Clean oil is better than dirty oil
Clean oil of the right viscosity is better than clean of the wrong viscosity.

Apply as needed.

Crow · **Reply #21 on:** June 02, 2015, 08:10:25 PM

Quote from: tosh on June 02, 2015, 08:03:34 PM

Quote from: Crow on June 02, 2015, 07:53:22 PM
I would rather change oil and filter now, drive 2-3 thousand km. And then change again. Use same good guality oil. Ther will allways be left some of old oil.

Even better would be to change oil and filter, drive 2-3 thousand, take oil bottom off, wash it and change oil ring and filte, put in new oil. No old oil left in engine.

You mean take off sump?
I did consider that, but I can't find a workshop manual for the car. Do you have to replace the sump gasket? And how would I find the torque setting for the sump bolts?

What's an "oil ring"? Is it the copper washer on the sump plug?

Sorry for my bad english. Translators will not allwas give best translations.

Yes. Oil sump. And by oil ring i mean oil seal that goes around oil sump. You should change that copper ring after every oil change.

You could download "autodata" program, that program shows every work step, and gives all torgue settings.

scattergun13 · **Reply #22 on:** June 03, 2015, 01:52:53 AM

Hi Tosh, congrats on the new ride. I think it needs a half liter of WD-40 and then have them top off the blinker fluid!

I'm sorry. I just couldn't resist. I know nothing about cars except how to drive the wheels off of them. It sounds like you're getting good advice here.

Cheers,

Stew...

NKlamerus · **Reply #23 on:** June 03, 2015, 02:31:10 AM

Stew don't forget to grease the Muffler Bearings^^^

scattergun13 · **Reply #24 on:** June 03, 2015, 03:26:00 AM

Quote from: NKlamerus on June 03, 2015, 02:31:10 AM

Stew don't forget to grease the Muffler Bearings^^^

That's right. And make sure the tires are round. Also change the air in them. Not the pressure, just the air...

scattergun13 · **Reply #25 on:** June 03, 2015, 03:27:17 AM

Sorry again Tosh but NK sort of encouraged me and we all know what kind of influence he is...

tosh · **Reply #26 on:** June 03, 2015, 08:40:40 AM

So to cap off...
Add WD40
Top up the Blinkers
Grease the Muffler
Ensure the wheels are roundish!!
Change the Air

All sound advice there, I'm good to go!!

Because I'm still cycling to work - trying to stick with it as it's the only excercise I get these days

I took little Suzy for a spin, sure puts a smile on my face that's for sure.
Hoping to get the oil changed this weekend. Still unsure what's the best to put in. Mineral, semi-synthetic or full synthetic.
I don't see the car being used for anything other than just nipping here and there. Having said that my partner has used it everyday since it's arrival for commuting to work - while our main car just sits on the drive!! Pretty certain the novelty will wear off soon enough.

The manual states preferred choice 10w-30 but doesn't say what type.... mineral or synthetic??

Crow · **Reply #27 on:** June 03, 2015, 08:54:45 AM

Seems most search results comes up with 5w 30 fully synthetic. you can use 10w 30 semi synthetic without problems.

Suzuki forums is good place to search answers also. You can look preferences at oil manufacturers sites also.

Edit. Mobil oil search gives new life fully synthetic 0w 40 and volume 3,1-3,2 litres.

http://www.mobil.co.uk/UK-English-LCW/carengineoils_which-oil.aspx

scattergun13 · **Reply #28 on:** June 03, 2015, 12:32:37 PM

Quote from: tosh on June 03, 2015, 08:40:40 AM

So to cap off...
Add WD40
Top up the Blinkers
Grease the Muffler
Ensure the wheels are roundish!!
Change the Air

All sound advice there, I'm good to go!!

Because I'm still cycling to work - trying to stick with it as it's the only excercise I get these days
I took little Suzy for a spin, sure puts a smile on my face that's for sure.
Hoping to get the oil changed this weekend. Still unsure what's the best to put in. Mineral, semi-synthetic or full synthetic.
I don't see the car being used for anything other than just nipping here and there. Having said that my partner has used it everyday since it's arrival for commuting to work - while our main car just sits on the drive!! Pretty certain the novelty will wear off soon enough.

The manual states preferred choice 10w-30 but doesn't say what type.... mineral or synthetic??