Slidelocks being discontinued?

[Eyegor]

Inspired by the Adventurer thread but I didn't want to hijack.
Who has more info on slidelock models being discontinued? Count me as another one that prefers them over the liner locks. The Rucksack and the Hunter are my two favorite even though my EDC for now is a Wenger Ranger 56. May have to scoop a couple slide locks up if the info is correct.

[WoodsDuck]

I wouldn't be surprised if they discontinued the models with a liner lock alternative available, but until they make a one-hand WorkChamp, I don't see the slide lock going anywhere.

[glenfiddich1983]

I would really love for all 111mm models to be liner lock instead of slide lock with those ugly buttons on the back! 

So yes please discontinue the slidelocks ASAP 

[Grass]

I'm keener to see the liner lock in more models; less keen to see the slide lock go. It's all speculation for the moment anyway...

[glenfiddich1983]

I'm keener to see the liner lock in more models; less keen to see the slide lock go. It's all speculation for the moment anyway...

Of course they can co-exist, but I would for example really love an Outrider with liner lock!

[parman53]

I saw a photo here a while back where the side lock had broken on some ones SAK. They had taken the scale off and I was surprised how flimsy the design was. But if people like them it will be a shame if they are discontinued. They have discontinued a lot of SAK's that I wish were still available.

[Corwyn]

Slidelocks is a pretty poor, flimsy design. However the linerlock is backwards.
The S-system sticks out and hangs on stuff.
The only decently designed locking system is the Ranger-button release and that is also touch&go...

Honestly SAK-people suck at making locks. Just steal an engineer from Spyderco or Emerson and design a proper lock already.

Also the Hercules/Workchamp are too popular to be discontinued.

[WoodsDuck]

Slidelocks is a pretty poor, flimsy design. However the linerlock is backwards.
The S-system sticks out and hangs on stuff.
The only decently designed locking system is the Ranger-button release and that is also touch&go...

Honestly SAK-people suck at making locks. Just steal an engineer from Spyderco or Emerson and design a proper lock already.

Also the Hercules/Workchamp are too popular to be discontinued.

I'm gonna get me one of them eventually... Probably a Hercules, since I don't really feel like the file is worth $30.

[SAK Guy]

Slidelocks is a pretty poor, flimsy design. However the linerlock is backwards.
The S-system sticks out and hangs on stuff.
The only decently designed locking system is the Ranger-button release and that is also touch&go...

Honestly SAK-people suck at making locks. Just steal an engineer from Spyderco or Emerson and design a proper lock already.

Also the Hercules/Workchamp are too popular to be discontinued.

I'm gonna get me one of them eventually... Probably a Hercules, since I don't really feel like the file is worth $30.

Hercs are great (almost) "all in one's" to throw in a camping box/bag!

[Eyegor]

Slidelocks is a pretty poor, flimsy design. However the linerlock is backwards.
The S-system sticks out and hangs on stuff.
The only decently designed locking system is the Ranger-button release and that is also touch&go...

Sorry that has been your experience. While I agree they aren't the strongest, I've never had one fail. And as a lefty, both the slide and the liner locks work great for me. I also like the Ranger button mentioned.
Nothing to do with SAKs but I just don't like liner or frame locks in general. Something about having your finger or thumb in the path of the blade when the lock is released.
Whether it is locks, scales, tools, etc.; one of the hallmarks of SAKs has been the variety of choices available. Let's hope that continues.

[Humppa]

I like the Slidelock as it is. The Linerlock ain´t bad either.

Both have their place.

I never let the slidelock fail on any of my tools. As did the linerlock on Vics.

But I tend to use my tools not as prybars or too hard and heavy. If it is used properly and the tool is kept clean, I see no difference in both systems.

To me, it would be a pitty if the slidelocks would be discontinued. I really like the Rucksack as a good outdoor tool.

[Syph007]

It would make sense for lots of reasons if they did.  It also fits in with my conspiracy theory that the new scissors from the pioneer x are going to be put on a liner lock SAK. 

[metasyntax]

I'll be the first to admit that I don't actually know anything, but...

Right now you've got three lines of knives that are extremely similar: 111mm slide lock, 111mm liner lock, and 130mm Ranger. The slide locks and liner locks are similar manufacturing-wise, but the slide locks have more tool options. The liner locks and Rangers have very similar offerings (OHT / RangerGrip 78). It seems to me that Victorinox could want to remove redundancy in these larger frames. Maybe that means getting rid of the slide locks and moving some tools to the liner locks. I don't think liner locks are going away because of the soldier knife, plus the OHT is really popular. I doubt the Rangers are going away because they're also popular.

I see a similar situation in the 85mm line. From the perspective of manufacturing all those parts, why have so much functional redundancy between those and the 91mm knives? Two different pliers, two different scissors. Maybe getting rid of the Wenger can opener was the first step in unifying the two lines.

I'd like to see liner lock versions of the Outrider, Workchamp, etc. I'd like to see the Rangers stay right where they are. And I'd like to see more options (nail file instead of small blade, "locking" bottle opener) from 85mm put on the 91mm.

[Sea Monster]

I am inclined to feel that they'll lose the slide lock, but it's just a "finger in the air" type guess.

I've not had a problem with the slidelock, but assuming you put force in the generally accepted directions, Locks should not generally fail.

Safety systems are a back up in case of something going wrong, not a challenge to be overcome.

[Okie Shyster]

In looking at a number of on-line knife vendor sites, unfortunately it appears that only the Outrider, Hunter, Hercules, and Workchamp remain in the slidelocks, at least in the U.S. 

Hate to see that as I, too, prefer the slide lock to the liner lock and particularly liked the more minimalist ones like the Adventurer and Picknicker.   

[Eins]

In looking at a number of on-line knife vendor sites, unfortunately it appears that only the Outrider, Hunter, Hercules, and Workchamp remain in the slidelocks, at least in the U.S. 

Hate to see that as I, too, prefer the slide lock to the liner lock and particularly liked the more minimalist ones like the Adventurer and Picknicker.   

What is the status of Skipper? It recently became available here in India and is also mentioned in the 2016 US catalogue.

Thanks

[Okie Shyster]

In looking at a number of on-line knife vendor sites, unfortunately it appears that only the Outrider, Hunter, Hercules, and Workchamp remain in the slidelocks, at least in the U.S. 

Hate to see that as I, too, prefer the slide lock to the liner lock and particularly liked the more minimalist ones like the Adventurer and Picknicker.   

What is the status of Skipper? It recently became available here in India and is also mentioned in the 2016 US catalogue.

Thanks

Yep, missed that one.  Looks like it is still available.  The best bet is probably what's shown in the 2016 U.S. catalog.

[Eins]

In looking at a number of on-line knife vendor sites, unfortunately it appears that only the Outrider, Hunter, Hercules, and Workchamp remain in the slidelocks, at least in the U.S. 

Hate to see that as I, too, prefer the slide lock to the liner lock and particularly liked the more minimalist ones like the Adventurer and Picknicker.   

What is the status of Skipper? It recently became available here in India and is also mentioned in the 2016 US catalogue.

Thanks

Yep, missed that one.  Looks like it is still available.  The best bet is probably what's shown in the 2016 U.S. catalog.

Maybe we can add Cheese knife (0.8833.W) to the list too (?) - not sure of the locking mechanism 

On topic - I read somewhere that Slide lock (SL) is not as strong as a liner lock(LL), in fact the latter was developed to gain more security and reliability over SL in the first place. This is the reason why I don't have an Outrider - I really wanted a 111mm model with scissors. Although I do not use them (111mm) heavily or frequently (Huntsman/Pioneer do the job on most occasions) but that article somehow convinced me not to go with any model that has SL   


I have a few questions related to the discussion.


- Why does the awl/reamer on LL models doesn't have the sewing eye but those on SL ones do?


- Is the LL mechanism on SAKs more friendlier towards left-handed individuals rather than right-handed ones? At first I didn't notice it with Centurion and Nomad but after I got OH Soldier and OH Forester I realised that "true" one-handed operation is possible perhaps only for the southpaws. An exception perhaps is the serrated/gutting blade on Hunter XT-CS but the main blade lock mechanism favours left-handed individuals. Or is it possible that I received the left-handed versions of these 111mm models - by chance? But 5/5 of them?

P.S. To any lefty reading this - You guys are awesome the point mentioned above was just an observation.

[Corwyn]

That's intended mate... the Vic linerlocks are based on the German Army knife and the German law prohibits knives that can be both opened and closed one-handed...

[Okie Shyster]

That's intended mate... the Vic linerlocks are based on the German Army knife and the German law prohibits knives that can be both opened and closed one-handed...

Thanks, Corwyn!  That's  the first explanation of Vic's backward liner locks I've seen that makes sense.   

How does German law deal with the fact that for left handers it can be open and closed one-handed?   

[Steinar]

That's intended mate... the Vic linerlocks are based on the German Army knife and the German law prohibits knives that can be both opened and closed one-handed...

Thanks, Corwyn!  That's  the first explanation of Vic's backward liner locks I've seen that makes sense.   

How does German law deal with the fact that for left handers it can be open and closed one-handed?   

It's a locking OH knife, it's illegal for EDC in Germany anyway.

[lowtech]

Steinar is correct.

The law prohibits knives that are one hand opening and locking. you can have each (locking or OHO) but not combined. Except for reasonable use (at your job,or out hunting/fishing).
There are more regulations and other prohibited knives, but that´s about it for one hand knives.

[WoodsDuck]

The only real disadvantages SLs have versus LLs is that the SL can be clogged by mud or other substances, and the lock can be completely ruined if the scale is melted. These could certainly become issues for soldiers in the field, but I've never personally melted one of my knives, and under all but the most extreme circumstances I'd think you could clean out a dirty lock.
Additionally, I've never had a lock fail on any knife, no matter how cheap and poorly made, because I don't press on the back of the blade. I wonder if people who worry about the SL model SAKs realize that you can completely remove the lock and it becomes a slipjoint exactly like the vast majority of SAKs that exist. How many times have your 91mm SAKs closed in use and injured you? It's zero for me, though as a child I learned on traditional, slipjoint folders.

I would be very interested to hear stories from our members here of SL failures. We have one of the largest collectives of enthusiasts in the world here, and I know a lot of us carry and use SL SAKs. So odds are if the lock sucks, we can fill a thread with stories about its failures quite easily.

My Outrider's lock still works. How about yours?

[Corwyn]

The only real disadvantages SLs have versus LLs is that the SL can be clogged by mud or other substances, and the lock can be completely ruined if the scale is melted. These could certainly become issues for soldiers in the field, but I've never personally melted one of my knives, and under all but the most extreme circumstances I'd think you could clean out a dirty lock.
Additionally, I've never had a lock fail on any knife, no matter how cheap and poorly made, because I don't press on the back of the blade. I wonder if people who worry about the SL model SAKs realize that you can completely remove the lock and it becomes a slipjoint exactly like the vast majority of SAKs that exist. How many times have your 91mm SAKs closed in use and injured you? It's zero for me, though as a child I learned on traditional, slipjoint folders.

I would be very interested to hear stories from our members here of SL failures. We have one of the largest collectives of enthusiasts in the world here, and I know a lot of us carry and use SL SAKs. So odds are if the lock sucks, we can fill a thread with stories about its failures quite easily.

My Outrider's lock still works. How about yours?

Well I have three Slidelock SAKs and the lock is broken on one and the other slips from the lock (just by slightly pushing on the top of the blade with a finger.
I got both in second-hand batches, but I can tell you that none of my linerlocks had any problems (and most are second-hand too).
Also the Slide-lock (at least mine don't) does not act like a slipjoint... it just flops around...

[WoodsDuck]

Corwyn, I don't know what the previous owners did to those knives, but the blade isn't supposed to flop around. I've changed the scales on my Outrider, and the knife is absolutely a slipjoint when the lock is removed.

[nerfin]

Hi Woodsduck,

You are right.  The back spring still functions, and enables the knife to be a slipjoint without the sliding mechanism. 

The sliding lock almost works as a compression lock, where a metal tab on the slide moves forward in between the blade tang and back spring.  When the blade is in the open position the metal tab on the slide is held in place by a u-shaped spring in the scale.  When the lock is working properly, the blade is very securely locked in place, jammed up against the metal tab and backspring....however the lock can fail if there is damage to the backspring, the metal tab, the u-shaped spring, blade tang or the scale.  As mentioned dirt may cause issues as well. 

I always test out any lock before use, and never take it for granted that a lock is an added layer of security and can fail.  Overall I feel confident in the slide lock, and it would be a shame if this type of lock was discontinued.

[SAK Guy]

I hope everyone here treats a locking blade knife like a slipjoint....it will save one lots of grief.

[pfrsantos]

All my SAKs with slidelocks have some blade play. I asked and it's normal. That's why I prefer the liner lock. With a little practice, you can open/close them one-handed, either with your left or right hand.

 

[Okie Shyster]

That's intended mate... the Vic linerlocks are based on the German Army knife and the German law prohibits knives that can be both opened and closed one-handed...

Thanks, Corwyn!  That's  the first explanation of Vic's backward liner locks I've seen that makes sense.   

How does German law deal with the fact that for left handers it can be open and closed one-handed?   

It's a locking OH knife, it's illegal for EDC in Germany anyway.

If just being a locking one-hand opener is illegal, then does anyone know why Vic chose to make its liner lock operate backwards?  Inquiring minds want to know.   

[firiki]

I don't know why people say Vic linerlock is backwards! I think it works great the way it is. Most of the time I use it while holding the SAK in my right hand and giving the blade a slight push with my left hand's part that's between the thumb and the index finger. I place the thumb of the hand I'm holding the SAK with where it will meet the tang so as to prevent accidental closure -the half stop on non OHO SAKs makes this almost pointless.

I like slidelock models, the slide lock itself not so much, for pretty much the reasons covered already. Still, I'd like to see Vic improve the design rather than discontinuing the line. Linerlock models are heavier in comparison to their slidelock counterparts, that's both a pro and a con.

My 2 cents.