Swisstool X (Plus ?) - Initial thoughts.

[DaveK]

I've actually got quite a busy schedule ahead of me this week, decorating and doing general "unemployed" type stuff, but I might add some comparison pics to this thread later in the week if I get chance.

I've seen the Swisstool mentioned on these forums almost daily since I joined, and it's evident that most people hold it up as the "Holy Grail" of multitools, and forever eulogise about "fit and finish", "rust resistance" and general quality.

My experience of the tool until yesterday was limited to the above plaudits and a very brief pawing at the UK meet-up last year, when I was introduced to (I think) Dunc's. At the time I remember commenting that I couldn't see what all the fuss was about, but when I saw one at a good price on ebay the other day, I thought, why not? So I ordered it, with the sole intention of giving it a fair chance.

The model I got is labelled on the box as "SWISSTOOL X IN POUCH + FREE BITWRENCH". I'm not sure if that's the same as "PLUS", but having compared prices of BNIB tools since, it looks like I got a great deal .

The postman delivered this yesterday, within minutes of me receiving a brand new Charge SLV, which for those that know me is Multitool heaven, but I have put the SLV away, and carried the Swisstool around with me for most of yesterday and today, to make sure it sees some action. The Charge is a drawer queen anyway , but I wanted to be sure that I give the shiny beast a fair crack of the whip, and I think I have done.

My first thought on removing the ST from the box was that it weighed a ton, although it is a couple of grams lighter than the LM Core. That's OK though, as I ruled out EDC'ing an extra large tool ages ago and prefer the 4" standard sized tools. So straight away, I realised that this is not an EDC tool for me, this is a competitor to the Core, my favourite tool for around the house jobs.

As someone who likes to while away the time by opening and snapping shut the blades on my Cadet, or flicking the blade launcher on a LM knife, I immediately appreciated the series of satisfying "clicks" you get when opening the ST pliers and closing it again - that was nice for a while.

I don't like the plier heads though. In fact, they look ugly and the lack of needle nose seriously reduces the usefulness for me. I tried to snip some brass pin stock, and having small hands found it very difficult to get a decent grip on the handles. The highly polished finish doesn't help much there either. Although I have the same "reach" problems with the Core, I did find that I could get a much more comfortable and solid grip, cutting the same pin stock.

It gets worse. The tools in the handles. Oh dear. Look, I KNOW that I shouldn't bite my nails, but I do, and I am completely stuffed trying to get the tools out. I have learned that I can get the main blade out by first opening the saw to create a bit of space, then getting the tip of my index finger behind the long drivers in the middle, opening them to create yet more space so I can get my index finger in there to open the blade. It's not just the length of my nails, my RA plays a part too. Even if I can get a bit of grip on a nail-nick, I got quite uncomfortable pain in the first joint of my index finger a few times when trying to pry the blade(s) out. So, I'm not a fan of that, and of course any benefits offered by outside opening tools, are somewhat negated in my case To be fair, I'm getting a bit better at it with practice, but I want something a bit easier than this!

Then there's the blade locks. I will never ever criticise the blade locks on the Leatherman ST200 again! Again, maybe with practice I'll like them more, but I'm not sure I'll stick with it long enough to find out to be honest. The locks (or more precisely the release catches) are in the worst possible place. I would expect to be able to close any of the blades with one hand, but whilst I can do it, it would only be a matter of time until I sliced my finger off!

I realise that much of the above will be construed as heracy by many posters on here, but it is my honest assessment. I really didn't set out to bash this tool, and maybe I'm set in my beliefs of how a tool should be, but this one is going in a drawer.

There are things that the Vic Swisstool clearly excels at. It's solidly made, it won't rust easily, it feels "strong", but these are in my opinion secondary concerns in a tool. First and foremost, the tool has to be easily accessible, safe and functional before the above become an issue.

I'm glad I got it though, as now I know what it is all about. I'll probably sit and "click it" whilst watching TV, but it won't be the tool I reach for when there's work to be done.

Oh, the bitwrench is pretty nifty though - I like that.

Please don't flame me 

[Leatherman123]

I agree with all your points.. Wait till Mike, Ben, and Dunc here this! 

[DaveK]

I wish I had that popcorn eating smiley

Seriously though, it is just my opinion, and it is honest.

[Benner]

Well that was an expected review. 

Good review though mate.    I can't say I necessarily agree on all your points ( the locks for example are the best I have ever used on a MT ) but it is nice to see a change from the usual Swisstool praise from someone who has genuinely given it a go.

One thing I will say though is that the Swisstool grew on me the longer I had it.  It took me a while to appreciate it for what it is.

I agree with all your points.. Wait till Mike, Ben, and Dunc here this! 

How have I been labelled with them?  I carry a Supertool more than anything. (ATM)

[Leatherman123]

You have been labeled with them because you were one of the main defenders with Ryan's SURGE review! 

[Benner]

You have been labeled with them because you were one of the main defenders with Ryan's SURGE review! 

Yeah well, I don't want to go back into that, but the Surge is pants. 

[DaveK]

One thing I will say though is that the Swisstool grew on me the longer I had it.  It took me a while to appreciate it for what it is.

That's a fair point. I hinted at the fact that I have found my "perfect" tool - the LM Charge. It's impossible for me to evaluate any other tool without making comparison to that - whoever made it!

I have to ask though, do you not find the blade lock release buttons are in an awkward place? Again, I immediately compare to the Charge or Core, where they are situated on the back of the tool, so you can use your thumb joint and close the blade whilst keeping your finger out of harm's way. Haven't mastered that on the Vic yet.....

[DaveK]

You have been labeled with them because you were one of the main defenders with Ryan's SURGE review! 

Yeah well, I don't want to go back into that, but the Surge is pants. 

Hey - I personally wouldn't rate the Surge much better than the Swisstool. You'll notice that I compared to the Core - that's for a reason!

[Benner]

One thing I will say though is that the Swisstool grew on me the longer I had it.  It took me a while to appreciate it for what it is.

That's a fair point. I hinted at the fact that I have found my "perfect" tool - the LM Charge. It's impossible for me to evaluate any other tool without making comparison to that - whoever made it!

I have to ask though, do you not find the blade lock release buttons are in an awkward place? Again, I immediately compare to the Charge or Core, where they are situated on the back of the tool, so you can use your thumb joint and close the blade whilst keeping your finger out of harm's way. Haven't mastered that on the Vic yet.....

No not at all.  IMO, the locks are solid and very reliable.  They are very easy to release yet there is no risk of accidently releasing the lock when in use.  They can be released by those left or right handed and they don't dig into your hands when you are using the tool.  Those all all points which matter to me and the Swisstool excells in every one.  One handed lock release/ blade closure is not really important to me in a MT.  I just want a safe lock.

[DaveK]

I'm just trying now, and maybe when some of the new stiffness has worn off I can do better with the locks. I had been operating both buttons at the same time (if you see what I mean) but have just discovered that you only need to do one. Bit stiff still at the moment, but could be doable.....

How do you find getting the tools out? E.g. the phillips?

[DaveK]

Another question. Do the tools "loosen up" with use, or are they going to continue to irritate me?

[Leatherman123]

I cut my nails regularly, and I find getting out all the smaller tools is a PITA! They will continue to irritate you!

[DaveK]

Another question. Do the tools "loosen up" with use, or are they going to continue to irritate me?

That's what I thought, it's maybe the downside to the "satisfying snap".

[Benner]

I'm just trying now, and maybe when some of the new stiffness has worn off I can do better with the locks. I had been operating both buttons at the same time (if you see what I mean) but have just discovered that you only need to do one. Bit stiff still at the moment, but could be doable.....

How do you find getting the tools out? E.g. the phillips?

The phillips I find very easy as I have girly hands and can fit my little finger in over the top of it to get it out.  The 4 outer tools (File, saw, knife and scissors) are pretty easy to get out as well, but I have to admit that the others can be a pain at times to get out especially if you are like us and bite our nails.  

[DaveK]

I just tried using my little finger to get the phillips out and it hurt. Am I a big girl?

[Benner]

I just tried using my little finger to get the phillips out and it hurt. Am I a big girl?

Yes, yes you are. 

[Leatherman123]

Ben, what are your thoughts on the LM Core?

[Benner]

Ben, what are your thoughts on the LM Core?

Can't comment really as I have only briefly handled one.

[Leatherman123]

What multitool are you going to buy next? The SOG PowerAssist? I have to wait until Christmas to open it, my Fiance is a witch!!!!!!

[Benner]

What multitool are you going to buy next? The SOG PowerAssist? I have to wait until Christmas to open it, my Fiance is a witch!!!!!!

I expect so.

Best start a new thread though as this isn't exactly inkeeping with Dave's Swisstool review.

[Leatherman123]

haha, I know!

[donvito]

My initial thought were a lot different than yours Dave. ST-X was my very first multi when purchased over 6 years ago, and as I've mentioned in the past I had most makes and models for me to chose from in the store when buying. The selling point for me was the size and the heftiness of the tool when I first pick it up. It just felt solid and almost indestructible, especially compared to the old Wave.

I can see where you are coming from as most of your experience is with Leatherman tools. I got my first LM MT recently from a forum member, a used (but in good condition) new Wave. The Wave was compared to ST in my eyes and didn't do as well as I've expected. I did like the one hand opening knives and outside opening wood and metal saw/file (love the diamond file btw), but the locking system compared to ST seemed inferior to me. Same with pulling the internal tool out on the Wave, the scissors are the worst.

After 6 years the implements are still offering resistance when opening, but if you use you thumb you'll make it easier on you self. I suggest oiling the tool, not to prevent rust (no problems on mine), but to help facilitate smoother opening. All the implements are top notch and suitable for any task you can through at it.

For me if given choice to pick only one MT the Swiss Tool X would be it.

[DaveK]

but the locking system compared to ST seemed inferior to me. Same with pulling the internal tool out on the Wave, the scissors are the worst.

I agree with the scissors comment, but I'm not sure how the locks are inferior? The locking system on the Wave is the same as the Charge and seems pretty reliable to me. I do think the ST-X is better compared to one of the "big" Leatherman tools though rather than the much smaller Wave. The Core seems a good equivalent IMO.

I think the overall gist of your post is right though, I guess we all compare to what we know and have confidence in, that's natural I guess. After that, I guess you're automatically looking for something that represents an improvement on your benchmark tool.

Anyway, I predict this one will be for sale fairly shortly. I'll persevere with it for a bit though, I do like the "click".....

[donvito]

but the locking system compared to ST seemed inferior to me. Same with pulling the internal tool out on the Wave, the scissors are the worst.

I agree with the scissors comment, but I'm not sure how the locks are inferior? The locking system on the Wave is the same as the Charge and seems pretty reliable to me. I do think the ST-X is better compared to one of the "big" Leatherman tools though rather than the much smaller Wave. The Core seems a good equivalent IMO.

I think the overall gist of your post is right though, I guess we all compare to what we know and have confidence in, that's natural I guess. After that, I guess you're automatically looking for something that represents an improvement on your benchmark tool.

Anyway, I predict this one will be for sale fairly shortly. I'll persevere with it for a bit though, I do like the "click".....

The lock does work and does it's job on the Wave, but it's not the same... Guess it's the lack of a snap when closing the implements (and having to push them in flush), and for me only the can/bottle opener is fairly easy to open it being the only one with a nail nick. The rest of the tools have a tab that's not comfortable to use.

[Leatherman123]

There is no play in any of LM tool locks, and there is quite a bit in the SwissTools..

[donvito]

Just played with the Wave and noticed something else that I didn't like. The ruler is on the inside of the handles witch is anoying, and for some funny reason they are continuous while lacking an efficient way of alignment of the handles. On ST you have a positive snap when the handles are half way open, creating an almost perfect ruler.

There is no play in any of LM tool locks, and there is quite a bit in the SwissTools..

There is some play on my Wave (fairly new) and much less in my ST (6 years of use).   

[DaveK]

but the locking system compared to ST seemed inferior to me. Same with pulling the internal tool out on the Wave, the scissors are the worst.

I agree with the scissors comment, but I'm not sure how the locks are inferior? The locking system on the Wave is the same as the Charge and seems pretty reliable to me. I do think the ST-X is better compared to one of the "big" Leatherman tools though rather than the much smaller Wave. The Core seems a good equivalent IMO.

I think the overall gist of your post is right though, I guess we all compare to what we know and have confidence in, that's natural I guess. After that, I guess you're automatically looking for something that represents an improvement on your benchmark tool.

Anyway, I predict this one will be for sale fairly shortly. I'll persevere with it for a bit though, I do like the "click".....

The lock does work and does it's job on the Wave, but it's not the same... Guess it's the lack of a snap when closing the implements (and having to push them in flush), and for me only the can/bottle opener is fairly easy to open it being the only one with a nail nick. The rest of the tools have a tab that's not comfortable to use.

Lol - the can opener's the one I struggle with most and I like the tabs, which maybe sums up our discussions very well!

I feel like I've been really mean to the ST-X, but it's obviously a very good tool. I just don't really regard the "snap" and shininess above the relative ease of use of a Leatherman. I also don't regard those things as evidence of "superior quality", rather just differences.

I'll probably pick up a Spirit if I can get one cheap, as I've compared the ST-X to the Core as it seems a closer match, even though I don't carry a Core as it's too big for me. A Charge v Spirit comparison would be a more worthwhile exercise for me I reckon 

[DaveK]

Oh - I have no play in any of my LM locks either! Or my ST-X

[Leatherman123]

It's up and down play.. What style plier head does your X have, Dave? If it is the newer head, I guarantee it has plier pivot play. I have had at the least 20 current SwissTools and every single one of them had the plier pivot play!

[DaveK]

It's up and down play.. What style plier head does your X have, Dave? If it is the newer head, I guarantee it has plier pivot play. I have had at the least 20 current SwissTools and every single one of them had the plier pivot play!

It's the newest plier head I think looking in the wiki - but there's no noticeable play I can see. I'm not knocking the quality of this thing - it's well made. I see the "up and down" play in the main blade though, but that wouldn't bother me too much. It's the getting the damn thing open that's ticking me off!