Combo Tool Fail

[nate j]

I had the opportunity to open a large (no. 10?) can of green beans yesterday.  I happened to have a Waiter in my pocket and tried to use the combo tool, but it was really something of a fail.

Because the combo tool is not actually sharp, it took significant force to penetrate the can lid.  Applying this much force wasn’t very comfortable due to the small handle and the key ring attachment.

When the tip of the can opener was driven through the can lid, it seemed to get stuck under the lid about half the time, and require additional effort to pull out.

In spite of these issues, I managed to work about halfway around the can lid, but at that point the lid was flexing so much that I struggled to make any further progress.

Disgusted, I ended up ditching the Waiter in favor of a standard dedicated can opener.

This was frustrating, especially as I have had success in similar situations with 91mm and 93mm can openers in the past.

Could I have eventually gotten the can open with the Waiter’s combo tool, if that was the only option?  I think so, but it would have been a painful and time consuming process.

Would this have gone better with a smaller, more common size can?  Probably.

Was this failure due to operator error/poor technique?  I don’t believe so; I don’t think my technique was fundamentally flawed, though there is always room for improvement with practice.

Overall, I’m disappointed enough in the performance of the 84mm combo tool that I’m reevaluating some of my carry options.  And if anyone wants to use a SAK to actually open cans, I strongly recommend the standard can opener in at least a 91mm frame.

[nate j]

Oops, double post!

[Jazz]

I work in a kitchen, and know (by trial and error) that you should just use an industrial can opener for those big ass cans. They’re obviously quite thick.

[nate j]

I work in a kitchen, and know (by trial and error) that you should just use an industrial can opener for those big ass cans. They’re obviously quite thick.

No doubt that would be the best tool for the job.

I’m thinking a P-51 might be a good option while remaining pocketable/portable.

But I expected better from the combo tool.

[Farmer X]

Jazz confirmed my initial thoughts: that those big cans are rather thick. Perhaps a 111mm is better suited for them?

[nate j]

Jazz confirmed my initial thoughts: that those big cans are rather thick. Perhaps a 111mm is better suited for them?

The larger, longer handle of a 111mm would have been more comfortable and provided better leverage.   

And, as noted earlier, the standard Vic can opener is much superior to the combo tool for opening cans.

[pfrsantos]

The larger, longer handle of a 111mm would have been more comfortable and provided better leverage.   

And, as noted earlier, the standard Vic can opener is much superior to the combo tool for opening cans.

Anywho, when that's the only tool available, maybe it's just a matter of trying a few more times, to see how it can be used in a way that's more efficient and easy. Instead of giving up, I'd try to use it again (when you don't need to), to get more practice and experience (for when you need it).

 

[fullbreakfast]

This is one of several reasons why I much prefer the full opener layer to the combo tool.  Too many compromises in that tool. You can drive a Phillips screw, sort of, but not well. Can opener beats it.  You can open a can maybe, but can opener easily beats it. You can pry, or drive a large flathead with it, but not as well as you could with with the bottle opener. You can't drive a small flathead, or do really small prying like you would be able to with the can opener. There's no sharp edge for package opening or scraping like you have with the can opener.

I never managed to carry a Compact for long, and this was the reason. It would come up - not occasionally but really often - that I would be trying to do something with the combo tool, and wishing I had the opener layer instead.

[IMR4198]

   I have used the combo tool on a 108mm many times.  Plenty of leverage with that tool.  It is a struggle anyway and messes up the can lid a lot at best.  Makes you wonder about can fragments in your food.  It is better than nothing at all, but not by a whole lot.  Best wishes.  G
 

[nate j]

Anywho, when that's the only tool available, maybe it's just a matter of trying a few more times, to see how it can be used in a way that's more efficient and easy. Instead of giving up, I'd try to use it again (when you don't need to), to get more practice and experience (for when you need it).

 

I’m of the opinion at this point that it’s just a really poor can opener, which is disappointing because I feel like Vic usually puts a fair amount of thought into their tools.  Practice on my part isn’t going to fix or change that, unless someone can point me towards a fundamentally different technique that is far more effective.

I believe the superior option will be to have a better tool on hand.  I had been thinking about replacing my wallet Alox Bantam with a P-51 for the upcoming Toolbox Challenge, but now thinking that change could be permanent.  We will see.

[nate j]

This is one of several reasons why I much prefer the full opener layer to the combo tool.  Too many compromises in that tool. You can drive a Phillips screw, sort of, but not well. Can opener beats it.  You can open a can maybe, but can opener easily beats it. You can pry, or drive a large flathead with it, but not as well as you could with with the bottle opener. You can't drive a small flathead, or do really small prying like you would be able to with the can opener. There's no sharp edge for package opening or scraping like you have with the can opener.

I never managed to carry a Compact for long, and this was the reason. It would come up - not occasionally but really often - that I would be trying to do something with the combo tool, and wishing I had the opener layer instead.

Yep, I agree.  I carried a Climber for a long time, but couldn’t really get on with the Compact.

[Ron Who]

I never thought of the combo tool as a can opener. I have it on the Bantam, Waiter, and Compact and only use it to open a bottle of beer. 

[nate j]

I never thought of the combo tool as a can opener. I have it on the Bantam, Waiter, and Compact and only use it to open a bottle of beer. 

Vic officially lists the functions of the combo tool as cap lifter, can opener, screwdriver, and wire stripper.  I agree it’s great as a cap lifter, but marginal as a screwdriver, and lousy as a can opener I’m afraid.  I haven’t used the wire stripper function.

[cbl51]

This is one of several reasons why I much prefer the full opener layer to the combo tool.  Too many compromises in that tool. You can drive a Phillips screw, sort of, but not well. Can opener beats it.  You can open a can maybe, but can opener easily beats it. You can pry, or drive a large flathead with it, but not as well as you could with with the bottle opener. You can't drive a small flathead, or do really small prying like you would be able to with the can opener. There's no sharp edge for package opening or scraping like you have with the can opener.

I never managed to carry a Compact for long, and this was the reason. It would come up - not occasionally but really often - that I would be trying to do something with the combo tool, and wishing I had the opener layer instead.

THIS!!!!!!!!!

In my quest for the ultimate in Maximum Minimalism, I carried an alox bantam for a while. What I found out was, the combo tool is a poor substitute for a real can opener. The bantam got gifted away and I just went with a cadet. Sometimes the old Wenger SI. I grew to love the regular opener layer of the 93mm's because they just work so much better at their intended jobs.

[ThundahBeagle]

   I have used the combo tool on a 108mm many times.  Plenty of leverage with that tool.  It is a struggle anyway and messes up the can lid a lot at best.  Makes you wonder about can fragments in your food.  It is better than nothing at all, but not by a whole lot.  Best wishes.  G
 

This, and lacerated thumb and Thenar Web Space.  Why try again? Yes, all multitools are less good than the dedicated tool, but this doesnt sound like a compromise.  Sounds risky for no good reason

Let's say you were in an emergency position.  Would you be willing to take the chance that you wouldn't get your fingers and hands sliced up by continuing beyond the halfway mark?  Sounds like you would have had a cleaner open just by rubbing it on a rock.

I civic with you.  Something bigger and different tool.  Vic opener on the 91 mm and up is great.

[Huntsman]

Interesting post Nate - Thanks

This is one of several reasons why I much prefer the full opener layer to the combo tool.  Too many compromises in that tool. You can drive a Phillips screw, sort of, but not well. Can opener beats it.  You can open a can maybe, but can opener easily beats it. You can pry, or drive a large flathead with it, but not as well as you could with with the bottle opener. You can't drive a small flathead, or do really small prying like you would be able to with the can opener. There's no sharp edge for package opening or scraping like you have with the can opener.
......

Yep also -    - I have always been suspicious of the combo tool for all these reasons - Standard SD + CO much better, especially re prying
And don't forget this .... If you take that option you also get the awl       ..... which happens to be one of my favourite tools

However not to say I won't go Compact or Bantam - If I am going for a really slim, minimalist carry  ..... But rarely for every day EDC  .... Except maybe a day in the office.

[Farmer X]

I've opened a fair few cans with a Bantam's combo tool. Getting through the lid can be a struggle, but it works well enough once that hole is made...on smaller cans, anyway. It does tend to chew up the can pretty good, though. And it can always be worse: opening a can with the first iteration of the combo tool (with the blunted cutting tip) can really be a struggle.

[IMR4198]

   I never tried a Bantam combo tool.  I have tried the Wenger combo tool.  The one I have won't make it through the top of a can at all.  I gave it a good old pull and thought to myself, "Why are you doing this?  You are going to break your cute little Wenger Picnic."  It would be easy to put a bevel on the combo, but not worth the effort.  The combo on a 108mm is very blunt. 
   I don't think too highly of Victorinox can openers either.  The Wenger claw is much better.  Leatherman openers are good too.  Best wishes.  G
 

[GrouchoM]

I never carry my Scientist due to my disdain for the combo tool. That's why I bought an Explorer.

[fullbreakfast]

  re

I don't think too highly of Victorinox can openers either.  The Wenger claw is much better.  Leatherman openers are good too.  Best wishes.  G
 

Wenger CO > Vic CO >> Vic combo tool

when it comes to cans. But the screwdriver tip on the Vic CO gives it a lot of extra utility that I guess most people use more often.

[nate j]

re
Wenger CO > Vic CO >> Vic combo tool

when it comes to cans. But the screwdriver tip on the Vic CO gives it a lot of extra utility that I guess most people use more often.

I’d tend to agree.

I also use the Vic CO for opening split rings and prying things where there isn’t enough clearance for the cap lifter.

[fullbreakfast]

I’d tend to agree.

I also use the Vic CO for opening split rings and prying things where there isn’t enough clearance for the cap lifter.

Me too. Prying open battery compartments, then getting out button batteries; or getting under the lid of a jar to let some air in. It's quite handy for that sort of thing.

[rep]

I carried a Gerber folding  Magnum Hunter and a P38 in the latter '70s and early '80s.  That was before I got into SOSAK.  Used the P38 as a screwdriver.  Don't tell Gary the P38 is multitool-ular.

[IMR4198]

My lips are sealed.  I won't tell that nutjob nothing.  Are you going to sign up for the Tool Box Challenge?  There is still one opening.  Maybe a couple of openings.  The challenge might never be held again.  It would make a very handsome first badge.  Best wishes.  G
 

[IMR4198]

   If anyone isn't familiar with the Wenger combo-tool.  Just to be safe.  Best wishes.  G
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[fullbreakfast]

   If anyone isn't familiar with the Wenger combo-tool.  Just to be safe.  Best wishes.  G
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It looks like a tired old basset hound yawning.

[psyjohn]

Now I can't unsee that. 

[powernoodle]

I'm somewhat fascinated by people who open cans in places other than their home kitchen.  Where, you know, most people have real can openers.

But I know it happens, because I read about it here.

I've just never done it.  And despite my vivid imagination, I'm hard-pressed to conjure up a situation where I would actually need a SAK can opener or combo tool.

[Farmer X]

I have tried the Wenger combo tool.  The one I have won't make it through the top of a can at all.

The Wenger combo tool definitely takes some effort if your aim is to bust into a can. Though I must admit I am rather fond of my Wenger Picnic.

I'm somewhat fascinated by people who open cans in places other than their home kitchen.  Where, you know, most people have real can openers.

I am not most people. Why invest in waste my money on an electric can opener or a crank type when I have a few P-51s and a whole slew of multis? I have never used a multi can opener outside the kitchen, but that may change someday.

[Huntsman]

I'm somewhat fascinated by people who open cans in places other than their home kitchen.  Where, you know, most people have real can openers.
But I know it happens, because I read about it here.
I've just never done it.  And despite my vivid imagination, I'm hard-pressed to conjure up a situation where I would actually need a SAK can opener or combo tool.

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