ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods

[Dutch_Tooler]

 

[Outback in Idaho]

The flat bit driver is now available to purchase.
Video:

The holster for the FREE P2 is also available:

And the FREE P2 and P3 bit-holder holsters are also now available. 4mm, Flat, and Flat with Bit extender options.

(Image removed from quote.)

Finally, the holster for the ST300 is also ready

Shop link in my signature below.

  So impressed would consider getting one of these series, along with your mods and accessories! Awesome stuff. 

[Poncho65]

Very nice job, Zap and love the sheaths

Also welcome to Matpar

[hbcorpse]

Hello all!

Long time lurker, and just registered today!

I have been obsessing over your work, ZapWizard, since this thread was born.

The LM FlatBit system is a must-have for my needs, and I was sad to see the Free P4 did not have it. That left me torn between carrying dad’s old Wave+ and my shiny new P4...I opted for the P4 as my EDC.

Then I discovered your work, and the rest is history.

My FlatBit driver and Thumb Tabs are in processing from ShapeWays, as of last Friday! Anxiously awaiting their arrival!

I know I’m new here, but I have two burning questions that I could no longer resist asking:

1. Have you figured out the torque specs for the Chicago screw pivots that hold the small tools (and soon my ZW FlatBit driver) in place?
- Contact with LM reveals that it’s a proprietary spec, which they wouldn’t share. - I’d really like to get this tool back to factory specs when I’m done installing my mod, even though I know my warranty will be out the window.


2. Do you have any plans for a horizontal version of the holster for the P4?
- I’ll admit, I’m a big ol’ fatty. My love handles make vertical carry uncomfortable.
- I also, however, dabble in the art of leatherwork...And I’ve been mentally designing a horizontal EDC pouch for the P4, a FlatBit caddy, the FlatBit extender, and a small Craftsman ratchet.

Sorry for the short novel here. Just really excited to receive my items, and to be able to communicate with a veritable “god of mod”...and, of course, all the members here!

Also, sorry for lurking so long!

I hope I can bring some value to this forum / thread!

[ZapWizard]

Long time lurker, and just registered today!

Thanks for the compliments, and welcome. Don't worry I lurked here for years before I finally made a post.

I have a torque meter at work that I can borrow to measure the existing torque on those screws. My P4 has been taken apart, but I have only messed with one screw on my P2. So In theory, I can use the torque wrench to measure how much it takes before they tighten/loosen to see what the existing torque is. But then to repeat that you need a torque wrench anyways.

In reality you can do this just by hand like I do in my videos. You get a feel for the tension and adjust it looser/tighter.

This has been requested a few times, and I have put some thought into it. It probably would have to be done as an open loop. I may take another crack at the design soon, now that I know the open loop is stronger than I expected.
The catch is it wouldn't hold any bits, as they would be shoved up against the belt. I have been thinking of making a stand-along bit holder for the flat bits, something that could be removed from the belt and used as a handle on the extender.

[Happy Gilmore]

Thanks for the compliments, and welcome. Don't worry I lurked here for years before I finally made a post.

I have a torque meter at work that I can borrow to measure the existing torque on those screws. My P4 has been taken apart, but I have only messed with one screw on my P2. So In theory, I can use the torque wrench to measure how much it takes before they tighten/loosen to see what the existing torque is. But then to repeat that you need a torque wrench anyways.

In reality you can do this just by hand like I do in my videos. You get a feel for the tension and adjust it looser/tighter.

This has been requested a few times, and I have put some thought into it. It probably would have to be done as an open loop. I may take another crack at the design soon, now that I know the open loop is stronger than I expected.
The catch is it wouldn't hold any bits, as they would be shoved up against the belt. I have been thinking of making a stand-along bit holder for the flat bits, something that could be removed from the belt and used as a handle on the extender.

Horizontal holster would be my jam as well, your almost my singluar driving reason to consider the P4 at this point lol.

[BePrepared]

This is just amazing work!      

[Dutch_Tooler]

I've only seen the video and not listened to it, so haven't followed the comments and I'm not sure whether you covered this:

On the topic of making the Surge blades fit, would it be an option to make the shank cavity to the depth of the LM shank, with the exception of a circular nub at the position of the hole in the LM shank that locally restricts the cavity depth to the thickness of a Bosch shank *)? Maybe that is sufficient to hold both types. Possibly in combination with a spring with a larger contact area on the shank...

Just thinking 

*) Edit: maybe just one of the Bosch thicknesses... 1.25?

Just curious whether you've had time to consider this Zap?

[ZapWizard]

Just curious whether you've had time to consider this Zap?

I guess I missed that post, sorry. There isn't enough room for multiple cutouts. However, I did work on redesigning the t-shank. The first thing I tried was multiple cutouts for multiple thicknesses, and the tolerances are just too small. (0.25mm steps). I then tried to figure out how to get a stainless steel spring into the design. Something like McMaster 9716K360. There was just no way to hold a off the shelf tiny spring, and I am not ready to start making custom springs.





Here is the design I came up with, and ordered prototypes for just earlier today.
It uses a two halves, one of Steel, and the other Nylon.  The steel part has the T-Shank cutout, 1mm deep on one side (Sliding side), and 2mm deep on the other side.  All of the back and forth cutting torque should end up on the steel part. Some sideways torque might flex the nylon part, but it should spring right back.



The nylon half has a spring-loaded arm. The arm is set to hold a bit of force on a 1mm blade, but accommodate up to a 2mm blade. The spring arm is hinged on one side, and has a stop on the other side to prevent if from moving too far.
Two dove tailed areas lock the two parts together upon closing, hopefully ensuring the nylon doesn't just bend apart. I have no idea if will work until I get the prototypes.

[fullbreakfast]

I don’t really have anything to add to this thread other than saying that it’s indescribably awesome and ZapWizard is a legend.

[Dutch_Tooler]

 

@ZapWizard: that looks like it should work. The spring acts to close the lower left dovetail in the pic - nice touch!

BTW, what I was suggesting was not a multiple cutout - just a single one, but with a circular nub protruding from the cutout's bottom, in size and position to fall just inside the hole in the LM T-shank, while other thinner T-shanks (Bosch et al. - these lack holes) lie on top of the nub. The nub might also be sprung, come to think of it.

[Dutch_Tooler]

Hmmm... the LM file and saw blade in your video appear to have a hole in the shank but those on the LM website don't...? I think I need to check that...

Edit: mine has the hole, where the Phillip's head is pointing at... 

[ZapWizard]

I don't want to rely on the hole being there, since most T-Shanks don't have it. I want to accommodate as many different blades as possible. Even massage balls 
Grinding down the Leatherman to fit the Bosch is easily done, just any hand file will do it, and it is removing just about 0.1mm of material.

[Matpar_McWolfie]

I get that but it would allow for a post to go through the LM blade, just as Duch_Tooler suggested. The post could squeeze the bosch blade into place, making it super stable, while allowing for the Leatherman blade to still fit.

That being said, I think the latest iteration of your design allows for more blade thicknesses to fit. If it works, that is one hell of an engineering prowess! Can't wait to see and buy!


Also, I was wondering if you saw that question?

Hey Zap, on another topic, I was wondering if your blade tabs would be reversible? Let's say I'm a big goofy lefty (which I may or may not actually be), and I decided to switch the serrated and the straight blades so the latter is next to my left thumb when I hold the tool. I noticed that the hole egde is ever so sligthly sharper on one side than on the other. Would you tab fit on both sides of the blade so I can use them with my current configuration?

[Outback in Idaho]

  Think Leatherman used t-shank blades with holes to keep them inside their newer blade exchanger using a flat spring iirc. Seems that would keep blade options fairly limited, requiring a hole. Making an exchanger that does not require the hole would keep blade options more open. Ought to break away from their standards, make an exchanger for t-shank tools without the need for holes to hold them inside. 

[Happy Gilmore]

I guess I missed that post, sorry. There isn't enough room for multiple cutouts. However, I did work on redesigning the t-shank. The first thing I tried was multiple cutouts for multiple thicknesses, and the tolerances are just too small. (0.25mm steps). I then tried to figure out how to get a stainless steel spring into the design. Something like McMaster 9716K360. There was just no way to hold a off the shelf tiny spring, and I am not ready to start making custom springs.

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

Here is the design I came up with, and ordered prototypes for just earlier today.
It uses a two halves, one of Steel, and the other Nylon.  The steel part has the T-Shank cutout, 1mm deep on one side (Sliding side), and 2mm deep on the other side.  All of the back and forth cutting torque should end up on the steel part. Some sideways torque might flex the nylon part, but it should spring right back.

(Image removed from quote.)

The nylon half has a spring-loaded arm. The arm is set to hold a bit of force on a 1mm blade, but accommodate up to a 2mm blade. The spring arm is hinged on one side, and has a stop on the other side to prevent if from moving too far.
Two dove tailed areas lock the two parts together upon closing, hopefully ensuring the nylon doesn't just bend apart. I have no idea if will work until I get the prototypes.

Seriously...we are not worthy!

[Dutch_Tooler]

  Think Leatherman used t-shank blades with holes to keep them inside their newer blade exchanger using a flat spring iirc. Seems that would keep blade options fairly limited, requiring a hole. Making an exchanger that does not require the hole would keep blade options more open. Ought to break away from their standards, make an exchanger for t-shank tools without the need for holes to hold them inside. 

Fair enough... but my idea for the nub is that it should only be able to use the hole in the LM T-shank - whilst the normal (thinner, non-holed) T-shanks on Bosch etc. blades should not be impinged. That is to say: make the nub only as high as needed to provide in-hole support for LM blades, but not so high as to come into conflict with the thinner blades: i.e. the flat upper side of the nub supports any non-holed blades.

I just got myself another set of spare LM blades - these are holed too, seems to be standard now.

Anyway, let's see if ZapWizard's new prototype works. 

[Dutch_Tooler]

I don't want to rely on the hole being there, since most T-Shanks don't have it. I want to accommodate as many different blades as possible. Even massage balls 
Grinding down the Leatherman to fit the Bosch is easily done, just any hand file will do it, and it is removing just about 0.1mm of material.

Fair enough, but see my previous post - the nub is not intended to interfere with thinner Bosch etc. blades and the thicker LM ones now come standard with holes...

[Dutch_Tooler]

Just a question if I may ZapWizard - how thick is the blade holder going to be at the tang? Checking various options on which tools to retain. Thanks

[ZapWizard]

Also, I was wondering if you saw that question?

The T-Shank will be reversible. The design is now symmetrical.

Just a question if I may ZapWizard - how thick is the blade holder going to be at the tang? Checking various options on which tools to retain. Thanks

It will be 0.17in thick at the hinge. The T-Shank holder will only be able to be installed where the saw is now located, along with removal of a single thin implement and the stacking washers. It must have a spring next to it, as I use that tiny extra bit of space to add some material. I removed the file on mine initially, but I think I am going to put that back and remove the bottle opener instead. If you instead decide to remove a 0.060" thick implement (awl or ruler), then you just keep one of the 0.01" thick spacer washers.

My 2nd order is still in production. Shapeways isn't exactly fast. Estimated ship date is Nov 19th, but they usually show up earlier.

[Dutch_Tooler]

 

[Dutch_Tooler]

(...) Shapeways isn't exactly fast. (...)

I hear you... there are a few items waiting for various deliveries to you and me both

[Rapidray]

I hear you... there are a few items waiting for various deliveries to you and me both

Nice carry set!   

[Dutch_Tooler]

Thanks Ray - well, not all of the items will be in the kit but I've ordered one of the holsters with room for 7 bits and the extender, as well as the bit driver. Can't wait till they get here - same for progress on the T-shank holder 

What's missing on the holster for my particular needs is a holder for one of the saw/file blades and the two long MUT bits. But I have a 3D printer and I'm toying with the idea of adding such a holder to the holster in some hopefully non-destructive manner  

[Rapidray]

I am sure you will figure out a way to do that!   

[Dutch_Tooler]

Meanwhile...

Box from Shapeways...

I was wrong... the holster only holds three bits since the variant I chose for longevity's sake is the one to which one can fit a metal belt clip (which hasn't arrived yet). No great deal. The bit driver fits like a glove and works well

Thanks are due to ZapWizard for his designs 

[hbcorpse]

I have a torque meter at work that I can borrow to measure the existing torque on those screws. My P4 has been taken apart, but I have only messed with one screw on my P2. So In theory, I can use the torque wrench to measure how much it takes before they tighten/loosen to see what the existing torque is. But then to repeat that you need a torque wrench anyways.

In reality you can do this just by hand like I do in my videos. You get a feel for the tension and adjust it looser/tighter.

This has been requested a few times, and I have put some thought into it. It probably would have to be done as an open loop. I may take another crack at the design soon, now that I know the open loop is stronger than I expected.
The catch is it wouldn't hold any bits, as they would be shoved up against the belt. I have been thinking of making a stand-along bit holder for the flat bits, something that could be removed from the belt and used as a handle on the extender.

Any luck with the torque meter?

Still haven’t found time to do the install yet, but maybe I’ll take a crack at it today...at the very least, the thumb tabs are going in!
————
As for the horizontal carry...

This might be a stretch of an idea, but...

Picture the holster standing vertically:

- What if you moved the Bit Extender to the left of the main channel, which would put it “on top” of the holster, when mounted on the belt...assuming it’s mounted on someone’s right side.

- Then, take the beautifully designed Bit holder slots and put them to the right of the main channel, which would put them on the “bottom” of the holster...

Removing the Bits from the back face of the holster would provide access to them on a horizontal carry.

[Rapidray]

Meanwhile...

Box from Shapeways...

I was wrong... the holster only holds three bits since the variant I chose for longevity's sake is the one to which one can fit a metal belt clip (which hasn't arrived yet). No great deal. The bit driver fits like a glove and works well

Thanks are due to ZapWizard for his designs 

I like that compactness 

[Poncho65]

Love the sheath and the bit holder I have a sheath from Zap that holds the Wave/Charge tools with room for bits in the back and the extender on the side and am very pleased with it

[Dutch_Tooler]

Playing around with the holster I conclude it is a very well thought out piece of kit. The Free P4 fits in four ways if you take the pocket clip off, two ways if you leave it on, including two or one respectively with extended implements (although I'd be careful doing that with the long tools, especially the bladed ones ). It uses the locks on the Free to lock the tool inside the holster, irrespective of how you put it in, so there is no falling out.

The integrated bit holders are a nice feature for frequently used bits - although the number of three is a bit limited - this is down to my choice for the metal belt clip variant, other variants have 6 or 7 spaces I think. The bit extender holder works well too. The whole thing seems quite solid, but I won't know to which extent until after I start to wear it.
Final verdict on wearability once the belt clip arrives (taking the slow boat from China, it seems).

I have thought of adding some extra holders for saw/file blades and long MUT bits, but can't seem to find anything that integrates well with the holster design while avoiding a haphazard DIY look and thus detracting from its otherwise professional look - also on balance I think I may need to carry at least one LM bit card for flexibility. I'll probably end up assembling some kit in a small extra holster or pouch.