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ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods 19973

Just Bananas Posts: 71,246
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #60 on: May 30, 2019, 05:57:28 PM »
 :iagree: that would be great  :like: :tu:

fail to prepare prepare to fail
Global Moderator He Who Has The Most Nuts, Wins! Posts: 59,065
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #61 on: May 31, 2019, 02:15:46 AM »
Oh, wow :o Awesome work ZW :like: :like:
Full Member Posts: 117
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #62 on: May 31, 2019, 09:23:16 PM »


So I worked last night on the 4mm configuration. I like it enough now that I am ditching the idea of making the flat bit driver, even though I know someone will ask for it eventually.

One thing was getting the bottle opener profile just right. So why not just copy something already known to work? So I copied the Leatherman Brewzer profile. And then tweaked it also work as a 1/4" hex wrench.
There was a bit of dead space in the middle, so I added a horizontal 4mm driver as well.

Finally I went through lots of configurations on the magnets. On my first prototyope the magnets installed via a hole at the bottom of the bit driver pocket. However, that meant every time you install a bit, it would slam into the surface of the magnet. And while magnets looks like solid metal, they aren't. They are nickel plated, sintered powder. And cracking the nickel surface can cause the magnet to break up.

I tried some side-loading magnet ideas, but they were both ugly, and didn't allow you to ream out the hole using a drill bit. (The material tolerances can vary a bit)

So instead the magnets install via a deep hole opposite the main bit opening. There is a 1mm thick wall of metal between the magnet and the bit to ensure the bit never strikes the magnet.
Because the hole is deep, you can stack two magnets to increase the overall holding strength.

Finally, the hole allowed me to add a 4mm bit driver opening that is accessible even if the tool is fully closed.

I am happy with the design, and will work on getting it prototyped soon.



Just Bananas Posts: 71,246
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #63 on: May 31, 2019, 09:26:33 PM »
That looks excellent  :dd: :like: :like:

fail to prepare prepare to fail
Global Moderator He Who Has The Most Nuts, Wins! Posts: 59,065
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #64 on: June 01, 2019, 04:23:46 AM »
Very cool, Zap 8) :like:
Newbie Posts: 11
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #65 on: June 01, 2019, 06:41:30 PM »
Make sure you have a P2 version of the holster and bit holder!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Hero Member Posts: 800
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #66 on: June 01, 2019, 09:17:02 PM »
Make sure you have a P2 version of the holster and bit holder!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It should be identical for both. And HOLLY MOLLY that looks incredible!  :gimme: :gimme: :gimme:
Full Member Posts: 117
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #67 on: June 02, 2019, 02:40:45 AM »
Make sure you have a P2 version of the holster and bit holder!

The P4 holster will not fit the P2. The P2 is thinner, and has some other subtle changes that would make it so I have to design its own (similar) holster. At $120 for the P2, it too much for right now.
The bit holder should work in either model.

--------------------







Here is the renderings of the design. It will take a few prototypes to tweak the tolerances, so it won't be out for a few weeks.
Hero Member Posts: 800
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #68 on: June 02, 2019, 04:24:45 AM »
The P4 holster will not fit the P2. The P2 is thinner, and has some other subtle changes that would make it so I have to design its own (similar) holster. At $120 for the P2, it too much for right now.
The bit holder should work in either model.

--------------------

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

Here is the renderings of the design. It will take a few prototypes to tweak the tolerances, so it won't be out for a few weeks.


Truly incredible..one nitpick though, would it be possible to have some kind of stop for the 4mm hole you have perpendicular to the tool? In other words having it so that the bits didn't go all the way through. Might be too hard with the tool thickness but maybe I'm wrong. Incredible job though.

I think going with the 4mm bits is a really really good idea. It also reduces the likelihood of Leatherman getting really annoyed with it since it doesn't use their flat bit system.

Replacing a single flat bit from Leatherman is a total pain but for $10 you can get something like this:


the extenders and flexable heads would even be usable with the tool you are making.

We're u still able to keep the 4mm hole open to be used while closed? If so that's uterly brilliant design.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2019, 07:17:44 AM by Happy Gilmore »
Just Bananas Posts: 71,246
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #69 on: June 02, 2019, 12:18:26 PM »
That looks excellent  :like: :tu:

fail to prepare prepare to fail
Full Member Posts: 117
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #70 on: June 02, 2019, 02:20:40 PM »
Would it be possible to have some kind of stop for the 4mm hole you have perpendicular to the tool?

We're u still able to keep the 4mm hole open to be used while closed?





Any stop I added to the horizontal wrench would lessen the amount of usable length, or make it usable on one side only. Instead, imagine just putting your finger on the backside, like you might do with a box wrench.

Yes, the deep hole in which you install the magnets into opens up into a second 4mm hex opening at the back.
Jr. Member Posts: 57
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #71 on: June 02, 2019, 02:46:31 PM »
Love your work...

Before I order, I was thinking of getting the mid mount "Large" size and adding the TheClip.com, Model 661BP

Would that fit ok?


Select "Large" for: Tek Lok compatible hole placement.
..
Can also attach to other mid-mount Chicago screw style products.

Designed to be compatible with the  TheClip.com, Model 661BP
Recommend Tandy Leather, Screw Post Model 1296-04
No Life Club Posts: 3,844
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #72 on: June 02, 2019, 03:06:06 PM »
(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

Any stop I added to the horizontal wrench would lessen the amount of usable length, or make it usable on one side only. Instead, imagine just putting your finger on the backside, like you might do with a box wrench.

Yes, the deep hole in which you install the magnets into opens up into a second 4mm hex opening at the back.

 :like:

Cheers!
Dutch_Tooler

Location: Southern Germany, most of the time
Full Member Posts: 117
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #73 on: June 02, 2019, 03:11:35 PM »


Before I order, I was thinking of getting the mid mount "Large" size and adding the TheClip.com, Model 661BP

Yes it will mount the metal clip. Rather than fix the chicago screw positions to just Tek-Lok like I did on the Wave, I decided to make it one fixed hole, and one slot. That way more products can be mounted.
There was a small issue on the Tek-Lok version which might have allowed the bottom edge of the clip to catch, but I updated the 3D model just now. One of the great things about 3D printing is instant changes are possible.
Full Member Posts: 117
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #74 on: June 04, 2019, 04:18:20 AM »






I 3D printed a mockup of the bit holder in plastic. I shrunk the 3D model by 3% to emulate the shrinkage that the sintered steel will have.
The plastic mock-up isn't strong enough to actually use, but it lets me get an idea of the general use.

The mockup showed that I am damn close on the latching profile. The tool folds out and locks almost as good as the metal implements.  I little tweak to the model will hopefully make it fully solid.

The 1/4" wrench actually works in only one direction, it is sort of ratcheting. I also did a torque test on my earlier steel prototype and the 1/4" opening on it was extremely strong, i may test it to full distruction at some point)
The mock up also helped me realize that I have some space I am wasting due to the springs on each side. So I altered the profile to be a total of 1.3mm wider, every bit helps with an object this small.

Finally, I modified the real hex profile to have a better fit, and ensure the end of the bit wouldn't grind against the chicago screw.

I ordered the bit holder in steel, along with a few other projects I am working on. (Rebar holster)
Hero Member Posts: 800
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #75 on: June 04, 2019, 04:24:16 AM »
(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

I 3D printed a mockup of the bit holder in plastic. I shrunk the 3D model by 3% to emulate the shrinkage that the sintered steel will have.
The plastic mock-up isn't strong enough to actually use, but it lets me get an idea of the general use.

The mockup showed that I am damn close on the latching profile. The tool folds out and locks almost as good as the metal implements.  I little tweak to the model will hopefully make it fully solid.

The 1/4" wrench actually works in only one direction, it is sort of ratcheting. I also did a torque test on my earlier steel prototype and the 1/4" opening on it was extremely strong, i may test it to full distruction at some point)
The mock up also helped me realize that I have some space I am wasting due to the springs on each side. So I altered the profile to be a total of 1.3mm wider, every bit helps with an object this small.

Finally, I modified the real hex profile to have a better fit, and ensure the end of the bit wouldn't grind against the chicago screw.

I ordered the bit holder in steel, along with a few other projects I am working on. (Rebar holster)

Amazing Work, but honestly I would have removed the tools from the other sided and kept the Philips and pry bar. The 4mm bits really cant apply the torque of those two tools. I'd much rather give up the less robust tools that have questionable strength than the ones I can depend on. but to each their own on this.

I can't wait to see how this thing looks at the end.
No Life Club Posts: 3,844
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #76 on: June 04, 2019, 08:51:36 AM »
:2tu: Looking forward to seeing how strong this turns out to be.

@ZapWizard, mind telling us which 3D printer/ plastic (ABS?) you're using? Looks like some neat printing :tu:

Cheers!
Dutch_Tooler

Location: Southern Germany, most of the time
Full Member Posts: 117
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #77 on: June 04, 2019, 02:40:21 PM »
mind telling us which 3D printer/ plastic (ABS?) you're using?

The mockup was printed on a Ultmaker 2, 0.4mm nozzle, 0.12mm layers, PLA plastic. It makes very clean prints most of the time. It took about fifteen minutes to dig out all the support material from the internal holes, one of the bad things about FDM printers.
No Life Club Posts: 3,844
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #78 on: June 04, 2019, 06:13:46 PM »
Thanks ZapWizard :cheers:

Cheers!
Dutch_Tooler

Location: Southern Germany, most of the time
Jr. Member Posts: 66
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #79 on: June 07, 2019, 12:41:01 PM »
Zapwizard, I have been lurking around for a while and first of all I got to say What an amazing design. And what a beautiful render  of the Leatherman P4. Since I use solidworks and inventor myself I know how much work and time such a drawing cost. Really incredible work!
I like the design of the bottle opener/ bit driver a lot too. But I can't help to think about an idea that might improve it.

At the moment you can us the standard 1/4 inch at the bottle opener position and the 4mm while closed, while open and from the side. My idea is to replace one of those. I don't know if it is possible but maybe you could replace the 4mm hole from the side with a hole that fits the flat leatherman bits. And therefor make the tool accept the 3 I think most used sizes. Again I don't know if it is possible in ways of strength and space but should it be possible I think it can be a real improvement.

I hope I didn't disrespect you in any way. That is not my intention at all.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

Full Member Posts: 117
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #80 on: June 07, 2019, 04:25:14 PM »
At the moment you can us the standard 1/4 inch at the bottle opener position and the 4mm while closed, while open and from the side. My idea is to replace one of those. I don't know if it is possible but maybe you could replace the 4mm hole from the side with a hole that fits the flat leatherman bits. And therefor make the tool accept the 3 I think most used sizes. Again I don't know if it is possible in ways of strength and space but should it be possible I think it can be a real improvement.



I could fit a Leatherman bit holder into that space. Mabye even a combination 4mm, flat bit opening. However, someone who picked up a Free P4 without every owning any other Leatherman won't have any bits, or even necessarily know the flat bits exist. I owned a wave for years before I even knew they sold other bits, I just figured I got Phillips and Flathead. Also, the flat bits can be turned in the 1/4" opening. But it isn't ideal, they lock in one direction, and let go easily in the other.

Input and ideas isn't disrespectful at all. This is a two way street, otherwise I would just post to YouTube and ignore all comments.
Jr. Member Posts: 66
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #81 on: June 07, 2019, 04:32:08 PM »
I didn't even thought about combining both flat leatherman and 4mm bits that would be awesome.

The good thing about the flat bits is that they are easy to carry and offer a lot of possibilities.

I understand that not everyone has the leatherman set. But adding the possibility to use can never hurt.
I think a lot of people on the forum have a set for one of the many tools they are designed for. And otherwise can be a good expansion.

But maybe I'm the only one who would like it.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk
Hero Member Posts: 800
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #82 on: June 07, 2019, 07:01:24 PM »
(Image removed from quote.)

I could fit a Leatherman bit holder into that space. Mabye even a combination 4mm, flat bit opening. However, someone who picked up a Free P4 without every owning any other Leatherman won't have any bits, or even necessarily know the flat bits exist. I owned a wave for years before I even knew they sold other bits, I just figured I got Phillips and Flathead. Also, the flat bits can be turned in the 1/4" opening. But it isn't ideal, they lock in one direction, and let go easily in the other.

Input and ideas isn't disrespectful at all. This is a two way street, otherwise I would just post to YouTube and ignore all comments.

I think you are really on to something, a Leatherman flat bit slot would actually be better (unless the hole works for both). Using the bit extender would prevent the bits from going straight through. This would let you put a lot more force on a screw. The more I think about it...just go with the Leatherman bits over the 4mm, it will make the slot a lot stronger, and give u access to ALL of the drivers at once. Amazing idea. This basically gives everyone something. I think the Leatherman extender makes that slot so much more usable than if it was 4mm, especially since there are already two 4mm bit insertion points.
Full Member Posts: 117
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #83 on: June 14, 2019, 06:06:39 AM »






https://youtu.be/RrU_kSBGWFc

Today I received the production bit holder, and it is beautiful.

Other than having to ream out the holes a tiny bit, it is perfectly ready to install. (See video) All the bit openings are just right, and the locking action is solid.
I have to think about if I will even add the flat bit driver opening since most people won't have them anyways. I am a bit superstitious about changing a model once something works.
The magnets are strong enough to hold the bit and it won't come out when flicking the holder out, but it isn't as strong as some screwdrivers. If you want it stronger, you can try drilling the 1mm separation to be thinner.
Please help me spread the word on placed like /r/Leatherman, we can show them the product can be improved.
Jr. Member Posts: 66
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #84 on: June 14, 2019, 10:01:23 AM »
I got to say it looks amazing. I mostly try to keep a tool as original as possible but this really makes me think twice.
You definitely should have worked for Leatherman during the design process. It looks better/works better/gives more options then the setup they used. We'll done zapwizard!

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

Global Moderator He Who Has The Most Nuts, Wins! Posts: 59,065
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #85 on: June 14, 2019, 12:22:51 PM »
That is so very awesome, Zap :like: You have really done some great work with adding the bit holder :salute: the sheath and it's different clip placements are also great :cheers:
Just Bananas Posts: 71,246
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #86 on: June 14, 2019, 12:47:35 PM »
Excellent work  :dd: :like: :like:

fail to prepare prepare to fail
Full Member Posts: 117
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #87 on: June 14, 2019, 04:25:01 PM »
I may need to make one change: The magnets have a 1mm gap of metal that separates them from the bit. Most magnetic screw drivers just let the magnet and bit come into 100% contact, this is why so many of them end up with broken magnets. However due to the inverse square law, the magnetic pull isn't as strong as I want. So I will change the solid 1mm of metal, to a small taper that tries to stop the magnets a bit closer to the tool surface. The danger is if someone needs reams out the hole they might tear though the tapered section and then the magnets can fall out. (Glue is the solution here). I got to think about if it is worth it.
Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 6,634
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #88 on: June 14, 2019, 04:43:37 PM »
What wonderful design and executed very well too!  Looking forward to the final product!  :tu:

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Full Member Posts: 117
Re: ZapWizard's Leatherman Free P4 Mods
« Reply #89 on: June 14, 2019, 04:46:40 PM »
I ran a few tests to ensure this is up to the task:



The bottle opener works.

--------------------------------------------



The 4mm bit driver handles plenty of torque. The tool body started to bend when I reached 14 in-lbs (1.6 Nm)

--------------------------------------------



The 1/4" wrench handled more than 30 in-lbs (3.4 Nm).

 

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