Victorinox Swisschamp v Leatherman Juice Pro

DaveK · **on:** October 06, 2008, 02:57:30 AM

These ramblings are inspired by jock1's earlier post entitled "Love my Champ", during which - jock1 explains how useful his Vic Swisschamp had been that day.

This got me to thinking, although I EDC a Swisschamp every day, that actually it isn't that practical a tool compared to say, a Leatherman Juice Pro. Then I found myself wondering how I got to that conclusion. Above all, there must be a reason why I EDC the Swisschamp and not the Pro.

So the following are my observations whilst comparing the two tools, typed as I go, with no pre-determined conclusion. Let's see where we end up......

I've picked the Juice Pro, as this is the most fully featured of the Juice range, it even has detachable tweezers!

As this is science I have weighed the tools, and it seems that there's not much in it. For the record, the Juice is slightly lighter at 189.7g, with the champ weighing in at 190.5g.

For the dimensions, I measured each tool at it "widest" point, including for protrusions / nail-nicks etc. Size - wise the pro has the edge again measuring 82mm (l) x 30mm (w) x 20mm (h), The champ registers 91mm (l) x 28mm (w) x 33mm (h).

The tool selection on each tool does vary slightly. As I'm too idle to check the manufacturers' specs, I'll summarise the differences based on pawing them.

Unique to the Juice Pro : Foil Cutter, Corkscrew Assist, Serrated Blade.

Unique to the Swisschamp : Hook, Pen, Toothpick, Magnifying Glass, Fish Disgourger, Chisel.

I'm ignoring flat head screwdrivers, as if you count the combination tools and the removable eyeglass driver on the Vic - they pretty much even out.

All of the above "differences" are functions that I don't really need on these tools, so for me at least, it's fair to consider these tools "equal" in their contribution to my EDC. They are comparable from here on in.

I'm not going to debate the oft-touted "fit and finish". In one hand I have a Leatherman, in the other a Vic - neither rattles, and neither is going to fall apart!

Let's start with the blades:

Both are razor sharp and will handle anything I'm likely to do with a tool this size. For me - the Vic blade is better as it is a bit more substantial, however I find the Pro's blade much better positioned in relation to the tool. With the blades deployed - the Pro makes a much more reassuring handle.

Scissors:

The design of the scissors is very similar with one significant difference - the springs. The pro has a significant piece of steel, anchored to the rivets that hold the tool together, whereas the champ has a much more delicate affair, that isn't that well attached. Whilst weeding through old broken SAKs for my attempts at modding, the scissors were the most damaged tools I came across. The spring was more often than not broken - or missing. The pro's scissor blades are partially serrated - I have no idea whether that's a good thing or not tbh

. The champs scissors however do seem to be sharper - both tools cut paper perfectly.

Files:

Initially, I thought the Vic's file was longer, but on closer examination, not so! The usable filing area, i.e. the length that has teeth, on each tool is quite similar, (Pro 56mm , Champ 59mm). Factor in that the Pro sports the LM Diamond file, and I'm afraid there's only one winner here!

Phillips Driver:

These pictures are getting worse aren't they? That might be to do with the bottle opener test that both tools passed with flying colours

OK - the phillips....

I love the driver on the Vic, and it has substantially longer reach than the pro's. The pro however has it's driver sculpted to take LM's removable bit driver, which could be useful.

Pliers:

The champ's pliers fall into the "better than no pliers at all I guess" category, but it's this one feature that separates the two tools more than any other. The pro's pliers are infinitely superior to the champ's, and their main advantage (size) doesn't even mean that the needle nose tips are any bigger. I.e. the pro could handle intricate grabbing as well as the champ, but also offers the leverage for gripping, or wire cutting that the champ's pliers would wince at.

So, those are my observations. Hopefully this hasn't turned out to be a biased Leatherman v Victorinox bashing - that isn't my intention. I think that in comparison of individual tools, the pro seems better suited for my needs, but I am comparing two "best in class" multitools here, they both rock.

I have commented in these forums before that I don't normally think of considering SAKs as multitools. I know technically that they have multiple tools but I still think of them as SAKs, icons and design classics. The fact that so many comparisons can be attempted above, suggests that the Juice and the Swisschamp blur that line somewhat.

NutSAK · **Reply #1 on:** October 06, 2008, 06:00:05 AM

Great comparison! It really is surprising how these tools, that initially seem very different, can be so closely compared.

One thing I'd like to point out is that the pliers of the champ (or any other SAK) can be manipulated into much closer quarters, such as inside a crowded computer case. I've used them with the plier partially folded into the knife (at a 90 degree angle to the handle) to change jumpers on the backs of hard drives. This could not have been accomplished with the Juice. So, there are rare occasions when the somewhat limited pliers of the SAK are beneficial.

An even more direct comparison could be made between the Juice Pro and the Cybertool 41. The phillips driver of the champ is great, and better than that of the Pro, but it wouldn't even be a fair comparison to the bit driver of the CT41.

max6166 · **Reply #2 on:** October 06, 2008, 06:20:38 AM

Great idea for a writeup! Well done!

Mike, Lord of the Spammers! · **Reply #3 on:** October 06, 2008, 07:53:59 AM

Well written, even handed right up!

Thanks mate I enjoyed reading that

Gareth · **Reply #4 on:** October 06, 2008, 09:11:41 AM

Very good write up. One question though, is there much difference in price? To my mind the only thing that lets the Juice range down badly is the blade shape. I know it works well but I just find it ugly, it's purely an aesthetic thing but I'm not sure I can get past it.

Grant Lamontagne · **Reply #5 on:** October 06, 2008, 01:17:12 PM

SwissChamp= $49

Juice XE6= $66.95

Since the Pro was a limited edition, it might be somewhat harder to locate, so I took the next nearest model, the XE6.

Def

DaveK · **Reply #6 on:** October 06, 2008, 02:26:33 PM

I've just read this back in the cold (sober) light of day, and I think it pretty much captures what I was trying to say - thanks for the encouragement guys

Terry - good point about the dimensions of the pliers. I bet there are other "restricted access" situations where the Vic's pliers could be preferable too.

Def - Yes - I went with the Pro purely because it was a closer match than the XE6, although I think the pro was slightly cheaper as it was only sold through Costco - not 100% sure on that though.

When I started, I thought I'd maybe come up with a clear favourite, but no - I still can't really choose between them. I guess they're just about different enough to be more or less useful depending on what you need at the time.

It was fun thinking about it though!

Benner · **Reply #7 on:** October 06, 2008, 02:43:44 PM

Superb comparison Dave.

EZ822 · **Reply #8 on:** October 06, 2008, 05:30:20 PM

Quote from: Defender on October 06, 2008, 01:17:12 PM

SwissChamp= $49

Juice XE6= $66.95

Since the Pro was a limited edition, it might be somewhat harder to locate, so I took the next nearest model, the XE6.

Def

Guess I was lucky. I bought my Juice Pro NIB for only $40 back in 2004. I thought it was a little expensive at the time but looking back, I guess it was a good deal after all. It's a great little tool. By the way nice job Dave.

Poncho65 · **Reply #9 on:** May 29, 2009, 04:08:10 AM

I had forgot about this thread until I started looking for Juice Pro related stuff great read Dave albeit the praise a little late

I just got a Pro and now I guess I need a Swisschamp so I can compare them myself

jzmtl · **Reply #10 on:** May 29, 2009, 05:16:51 AM

Didn't realize juice are that small. I now want one but for $70 it's not going to happen unfortunately.

Styerman · **Reply #11 on:** May 30, 2009, 06:24:31 AM

Good writeup . well reasoned .

Chris

DaveK · **Reply #12 on:** May 30, 2009, 01:45:21 PM

Quote from: Styerman on May 30, 2009, 06:24:31 AM

Good writeup . well reasoned .

Chris

Cheers.

Quote from: Poncho65 on May 29, 2009, 04:08:10 AM

I had forgot about this thread until I started looking for Juice Pro related stuff great read Dave albeit the praise a little late I just got a Pro and now I guess I need a Swisschamp so I can compare them myself

If you have any ideas about collecting SAKs, then I would suggest that you absolutely have to get yourself a Swisschamp poncho!

Crouton · **Reply #13 on:** June 01, 2009, 02:51:05 AM

Excellent comparisons. These are the kinds of comparisons I make myself when comparing two tools. This is also why I enjoy mt.org so much.

Great unbiased review that's what I like.

It's clear to me that the Juice line is "inspired" by the swiss knives, and I'm ok with that. For me if given the choice between the two I would have to go with the Juice pro because it has larger pliers suited for heavier duty work. For someone who didn't need substantial pliers the Swisschamp is clearly a great value.

Poncho65 · **Reply #14 on:** June 01, 2009, 02:59:21 AM

Quote from: DaveK on May 30, 2009, 01:45:21 PM

Quote from: Styerman on May 30, 2009, 06:24:31 AM
Good writeup . well reasoned .

Chris

Cheers.

Quote from: Poncho65 on May 29, 2009, 04:08:10 AM
I had forgot about this thread until I started looking for Juice Pro related stuff great read Dave albeit the praise a little late I just got a Pro and now I guess I need a Swisschamp so I can compare them myself

If you have any ideas about collecting SAKs, then I would suggest that you absolutely have to get yourself a Swisschamp poncho!

I know I just need to find 1 that is at a great price like my Juice Pro

nuphoria · **Reply #15 on:** June 05, 2009, 10:01:11 PM

Great comparison Dave

Well done for opening those bottles just for us

And yes, everyone needs a Swisshchamp - it's almost compulsory isn't it?!
I don't carry mine but my Juice KF4 is certainly getting lots of pocket time at the moment as all the tools on it are great really.

I don't like the Juice scissors personally so carrying another tool with scissors on like a Rambler or a Micra suits me fine.

jock1 · **Reply #16 on:** June 05, 2009, 10:15:54 PM

Cheers for that I may just have to egt a Juice to try it out for myself

Craig · **Reply #17 on:** June 05, 2009, 11:17:31 PM

Graet review

My Swisschamp and my CS4 are probably the two tools that I find most useful. I find I carry the swisschamp more than the CS4. I really like the magnifying glass , just for looking at interesting rocks and things rather than any practical use, and I find the pen useful. Also it might just be my particular tool but I can get the blade on the champ much sharper than the one on the Juice. That said I really like the Juice series and mine has seen a lot of use - as has already been said for heavy plier action, the Vic can't compete.

DaveK · **Reply #18 on:** June 06, 2009, 01:44:29 AM

I forgot all about this thread!

Shortly after I typed this, after carrying my Swisschamp around with me for over 10 years, I stopped!

The PRO and the Swisschamp are both great gadgets and I wouldn't part with either, but neither are as practical as my Charge.

Leatherman123 · **Reply #19 on:** June 06, 2009, 01:46:54 AM

I agree. For an extra two ounces I would rather carry around a Charge with locking blades, removable bits, and a cutting hook!

Chako · **Reply #20 on:** June 06, 2009, 02:06:29 AM

Great review. I enjoyed it a lot. I don't own a SAK, nor to I plan on it..but it is nice to see what they are capable of doing. I was rather impressed with yours.

Now I don't have a charge yet. I guess I might as well add one of those on the future list of acquisition.

Springs420 · **Reply #21 on:** June 06, 2009, 02:20:08 AM

Great write up there buddy! I've been thinking about getting myself a LM with corkscrew and reviews like these are pushing me closer and closer.

Two questions for you or whoever can answer them;

Is the PRO the same as the XE6, if not, what are the differences?
Is the PRO/XE6 symmetrical? I've heard gripes about this in the Juice line before, maybe someone can recap which models are affected by this horrible disfiguration.

Springs

Poncho65 · **Reply #22 on:** June 16, 2009, 05:02:37 AM

I believe that the Pro is symmetrical whereas the Xe6 is just a bit off

I believe that it lacks the tweezers and the foil cutter of course I don't have a Xe6 so I am not sure if that is all the differences or not

Hope that helped a little

Chako · **Reply #23 on:** June 16, 2009, 05:39:16 AM

Man oh man.

Looking at my previous post, what a change from June 5 to June 15. I now have a change, and got sucked into the whirlpool of SAK collecting.

Gareth · **Reply #24 on:** June 16, 2009, 08:47:51 AM

Quote from: Chako on June 16, 2009, 05:39:16 AM

Man oh man.

Looking at my previous post, what a change from June 5 to June 15. I now have a change, and got sucked into the whirlpool of SAK collecting.

LOL what a difference a week makes eh?