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Leatherman 5 star security bit

ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #30 on: March 18, 2007, 02:00:46 AM
Maybe they will be delivered in a black Suburban by two guys in dark suits and glasses? :P

Def
Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.


Offline Anthony

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #31 on: March 18, 2007, 02:03:34 AM
This makes me want to buy a Leatherman tool even more now...You guys who get the bits and take apart your tools, be sure to document everything here on the forums..
[


us Offline J-sews

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #32 on: March 18, 2007, 02:11:30 AM
This makes me want to buy a Leatherman tool even more now...You guys who get the bits and take apart your tools, be sure to document everything here on the forums..

Absolutely will do!

BTW, I just got some sort of confirmation email and receipt from Chad's. Still no hint that anything is amiss. (I'll keep a watch out front though for those guys in the dark glasses!)  8)
In order to be certain of having the right tool for every job.........one must first acquire a lot of tools


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #33 on: March 18, 2007, 02:14:17 AM


We are looking for Bob....


 :laugh:

Def
Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.


Offline Tom Munch

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #34 on: March 18, 2007, 02:30:40 AM
It'll probably be Monday before Chad's process the orders.  I imagine that's when we'll get an e-mail about "authorized users only" if we're going to.  I ordered other things as well, so my order may not be scrutinized as closely as yours, Bob.

Tom


us Offline J-sews

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #35 on: March 18, 2007, 02:37:10 AM
Good point. I've probably got at least a few days then before Agent Smith shows up at my door.
In order to be certain of having the right tool for every job.........one must first acquire a lot of tools


Offline Tom Munch

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #36 on: March 18, 2007, 02:37:48 PM
I received this from Chad's this morning:

"The torxPlus Security bits are a controlled item. Wiha requires a letter on company letterhead stating the intended use and storage of these bits before releasing for delivery. Email or fax is fine."

I do have my own business, but of course it has nothing to do with equipment that would need TorxPlus bits.  This may be a formality & they may just keep the letter on file in case Wiha asks.  I do have a friend who builds computers for a living & probably has TorxPlus bits or could order them legitimately for me.

Any suggestions?

I didn't know it would be this technical.


us Offline J-sews

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #37 on: March 18, 2007, 02:58:52 PM
Yep, I got the same email.
In order to be certain of having the right tool for every job.........one must first acquire a lot of tools


Offline Anthony

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #38 on: March 18, 2007, 03:01:33 PM
I'm sure you could come up with a paragraph or two with an explanation...be creative 8)

Don't one of you guys work at a machine shop?  Have them delivered to that address, or use their letterhead.  Explain in the letter that the shop just aquired an odd machine from...Canada...that has odd bolts on it and those bits are needed to repair the machine.
[


Offline damota

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #39 on: March 18, 2007, 03:17:40 PM
The only way you will get these bits is if some one is willing to break an agreement made with the company that produces them. What the legal consequences of that would be I do not know, probable they will be written off as a trader of that company and not allowed to sell their products, they would almost certainly lose there LM contract.
LM have changed to normal torx so why do you not get in touch with them and demand they either change your tool so you can maintain it yourself or send you the appropriate bits. As they appear to not repair your tool but send you another blokes tool that may be as rusted as heck is worth thinking about though.

Dave


Offline Tom Munch

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #40 on: March 18, 2007, 03:37:55 PM
Another tack would be to tell them straight up that I am part of MultiTool.org & that we study & modify tools as part of our research into tool design.  Tell them that we consult with different industry leaders in multitool manufacturer, & that we need the bits to disassemble & repair different tools.


us Offline hawkchucker

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #41 on: March 18, 2007, 03:56:53 PM
Tom, my son is an electrician that specializes in commercial construction. Would that surfice for them? He could say it is for security systems.
S


Offline Tom Munch

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #42 on: March 18, 2007, 04:06:36 PM
I know TorxPlus bits are used in computers, so I know my computer-building friend could get them.

I may try the "straight-up" approach though.  Def, do you have any comment?


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #43 on: March 18, 2007, 04:17:55 PM
I don't recall ever seeing them in security systems myself, but then I haven't torn any apart lately.

I see them mostly in fixtures and other things that manufacturers don't want people tampering with.  Next time you are in a pub and you go to the head, look at the fixtures holding the sports page- they are often "security" bits.

I think they are meant to be security bits in the same way the metal detectors at Wal Mart are supposed to be security.  They prevent idle tampering but aren't supposed to really secure anything too serious.

Def
Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.


Offline damota

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #44 on: March 18, 2007, 05:03:34 PM
I think a security bit will cost more for a company to use and the reason for that extra cost is the assurance that the tool to 'interfere' with them will not/never be available to the general public. I guess the reputation of the manufacturer under those circumstances is worth something and they will act upon people that break the agreements as the company that paid extra for those bits could go to court over it.
I can understand a games machine manufacturer using security screws to keep the kids out of them but I could never guess why a multi-tool manufacturer would even dream of using them. There is no secrets inside a multi-tool that a drill could not be used to find out.
To try to sell a so called tool to do maintenance on every one elses gear, that the owner is restricted to even tighten a screw on is ignorant and does not say much of that manufacturer atitude to there customers, I think that was well pointed out to them and that is why they are now using 6 star.
I admit that does not help the ones who bought the original non maintainable ones. I do wish you luck, though.

Dave


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #45 on: March 19, 2007, 11:28:06 AM
While I agree with much of what you say, you have to remember what I like to call "The Yokel Factor."  Many of these tools, like modern cars, are finely tuned instruments that a guy with a wrench and a hammer should not be disassembling and screwing up.  My guess is that Leatherman's Warranty Department gets a number of tools back every day from people who claim they have failed or had some other issue after having messed with the original design.  I'm certain they also open up a number of envelopes only to get a number of loose implements pour out on the desk.

Some companies (Like Benchmade for example) are well aware of the Yokel Factor, which is basically an incessant need for folks to tear things apart regardless of their inability to put it back together again.  I am certain many of us here have mild forms of Yokel Factor, which is harmless in mild cases.  Benchmade however has instituted a "Yokel Fee" which means that they will accept any of their knives back, refurbish and rebuild the knife (provided all the parts are there- if they aren't then the cost of the replacement part may be added added) for $20.  It's a great bit of insurance, but has probably backfired on them in the past, what with most folks thinking they can do anything to a knife they want and they can get it refurbed for only $20.

All in all, the security bits are probably cheap insurance against folks mucking with what is considered to be a finely crafted and reasonably expensive instrument.  Then, there are folks like us here that will just go the extra mile to tear them apart anyways!

Def
Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.


Offline damota

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #46 on: March 19, 2007, 06:33:59 PM

All in all, the security bits are probably cheap insurance against folks mucking with what is considered to be a finely crafted and reasonably expensive instrument.  Then, there are folks like us here that will just go the extra mile to tear them apart anyways!

Def

Apparently they were the only ones that thought that and after many complaints they have changed back to 6 star torx. That security bit was only used for about a year or so, I know one bloke who would not touch a tool that could not be self serviced, I may be a yokel or not but that is for them to sort out if I was ever sent one back to them (probably not bother because if it breaks once it will do it again and it would be better replaced with something different).

Dave


Offline anbqanbq

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #47 on: March 21, 2007, 10:16:22 PM
I once used 5-star bit to tight my leatherman Ti, I bought the bits from Canadian Tire. but my bit doesn't have a hole in the bottom, I had to destroy the pole in the screw. I don't think the leatherman checkes the tolerance carefully as swisstool does.


Offline anbqanbq

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #48 on: March 21, 2007, 10:30:33 PM
Actually if you buy the extra bit kit (total 42, for wave and charge) from LM, you will find the bit you need. But again, you have to destroy the pole in the screw, anyway, it doesn't the screw and funciton at all.


us Offline J-sews

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #49 on: March 22, 2007, 12:28:21 AM
Actually if you buy the extra bit kit (total 42, for wave and charge) from LM, you will find the bit you need. But again, you have to destroy the pole in the screw, anyway, it doesn't the screw and funciton at all.

Are you perhaps referring to a 6-star Torx screw? The 6-star tamper-resistant fastener is what Leatherman recently switched to. Driver bits for these, even with the hole in the center of the bit to accomodate the little post, are relatively easy to get.

For years prior to this though, Leatherman used a 5-star tamper-proof fastener. (I believe the Leatherman SideClip was the first tool to use them.) These 5-star Torx bits have proven to be very difficult to obtain. Fasteners and bits are both licensed by Textron, and they go to great lengths to limit the availability of the both.
In order to be certain of having the right tool for every job.........one must first acquire a lot of tools


Offline anbqanbq

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #50 on: March 22, 2007, 04:20:21 PM
"Are you perhaps referring to a 6-star Torx screw? The 6-star tamper-resistant fastener is what Leatherman recently switched to. Driver bits for these, even with the hole in the center of the bit to accomodate the little post, are relatively easy to get."

Yes, you are right. I found I made a mistake. That is a 6-star Torx screw. Sorry for the confusion.


Offline Tom Munch

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #51 on: March 22, 2007, 04:33:52 PM
I sent a letter to Chad's on my business letterhead saying:

I am making a purchase of 2 WIHA TorxPlus Security Insert Bits to be used for disassembly and assembly of Leatherman multitools.  I use these tools in my business for maintenance.  They will be stored in my office with similar security bits.

They told me that Wiha doesn't let them stock the bits, that I was approved, & that they would ship in a few days when they got them from Wiha.  Seems like a pretty easy process.

Tom


Offline Tom Munch

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #52 on: April 01, 2007, 07:26:57 PM
Got a notice from Chad's that the bits shipped yesterday USPS.  I guess it took a couple weeks from Wiha in Germany.


Offline supratentorial

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #53 on: April 01, 2007, 10:24:16 PM
Got a notice from Chad's that the bits shipped yesterday USPS.  I guess it took a couple weeks from Wiha in Germany.

Cool!


us Offline J-sews

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #54 on: April 22, 2007, 03:42:46 AM
5-star Torx bits finally arrived yesterday. I followed Tom's lead, and ordered them through Chad's ToolBox. The IPR10 bits fit the Leatherman fasteners perfectly.

Bob
ipr10.jpg
* ipr10.jpg (Filesize: 66.03 KB)
In order to be certain of having the right tool for every job.........one must first acquire a lot of tools


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #55 on: April 22, 2007, 03:44:25 AM
SWEET!

Gonna show some LM Autopsy pics now? :P

Def
Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.


Offline Tom Munch

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #56 on: April 22, 2007, 05:22:17 PM
I got mine too. I meant to post that.  I already bunged the nuts on my old Wave though.  Some of the nuts have deeper recesses than others.  The Charge seems to be deeper.  I've loosened up the really tight tools to be easier to one-hand.  I don't know if I'll be taking anything apart other than for curiosity.

Tom


Offline damota

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #57 on: April 22, 2007, 05:47:10 PM
Don't forget to drop a drop of thread lock between the frame and screw after you loosen them.
Pleased it has worked out  :cheers:

Dave


us Offline felinevet

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #58 on: May 04, 2007, 03:12:10 AM
5-star Torx bits finally arrived yesterday. I followed Tom's lead, and ordered them through Chad's ToolBox. The IPR10 bits fit the Leatherman fasteners perfectly.

Bob

Bob, mine just arrived from you. They are mega-sweet. I'm breaking those Waves down in 2 minutes flat. Once I get them all parted I will rebuild several out of the parts. Thanks, buddy, I really appreciate it.
T


us Offline J-sews

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Re: Leatherman 5 star security bit
Reply #59 on: May 04, 2007, 03:26:36 AM
Bob, mine just arrived from you. They are mega-sweet. I'm breaking those Waves down in 2 minutes flat. Once I get them all parted I will rebuild several out of the parts. Thanks, buddy, I really appreciate it.


You are very much welcome sir! I know you'll put them to good use when you're finished! (and don't forget put a little drip of LockTite on the screw threads when you reassemble.)

~Bob
In order to be certain of having the right tool for every job.........one must first acquire a lot of tools


 

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